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Post by roger on Feb 17, 2019 2:07:04 GMT -5
PAGE 24 Looking forward to seeing what you do with the dash Roger I to like to see things blend in with a design rather than being a collection of bolted on parts Hi Roger! I'm loooking forward to see the additional mods you planned You both still keep amazing me LOL!! Not sure if it is a good thing to blend in the windscreen into the front piece. I think the original concept (Eco-exo) makes great use of the steering bar+screen. With the Exo-r its less functional but still it looks good tough the bracketry takes some time to get sturdy. However, Sometimes I think I'd dig the Exo better as the-R Good luck! Erik Kelvin and Erik Thanks for your interest, I am working on a dash design that blends to the bonnet with no side openings. It will be a separate piece leaving the bonnet original. Since I used a 2008 donor scooter I am utilizing the clocks, windscreen,and clock housing and front dash trim from the same year donor. It has been difficult to land on a suitable design. I believe I have something that will not only clean up the edginess and also present a smooth transition from the dash to the bonnet. I would really like to do away with the ABS plastic cowl trim and do an overlay with carbon fiber. As I enter this information, the epoxy is drying on today's efforts. I will let it set up all day tomorrow and do some rough fitment and sanding. Cab-a-sil or Silica filler mixed with epoxy needs to be applied to the low spots to smooth out the contours. I really had to rough up the ABS so I hope the epoxy sticks to it. I will be posting pictures in the next couple of weeks. I will be doing a video as well. There is a problem using the 2007 and newer clock set. The clocks contour upward at the bottom while the main dash support on the frame contours downward, this makes for a large gap at the extreme right and left edges between the clocks and the dash bar. I hope I can use the space to my advantage as a mounting area for my Emergency Stop switch, stereo amp power switch, Dealer mode switch and a momentary brake light override switch*. (*for starting while not seated inside the drivers compartment) That's about all there is for now... I will be posting pics soon. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I keep looking at the dash and think.."It's coming along Okay" The clocks fit into it and the general shape is conforming to the bonnet contour.... but!!!!!! Something just doesn't look right. Before I invest any more time into this housing, I am going to leave it perched on the Eco-Exo to study a bit. Perhaps some bit of inspiration will strike me, or then again, maybe some elves will work on it. After all, "Tis the season". I know, I am being selfish and should ask the forum readers for their opinion(s). Here is what I am seriously thinking. It is too tall and way to wide at the front. I can re-design the width, but the height is something that cannot be lowered by much. The gauges are sitting on the steering column support. Perhaps if I just narrowed it and cleaned up the busy front it would help. Plan 2: This calls for trashing the gauges, and the OEM housing and starting over. I would keep the windscreen, and make a mold for a housing that would accommodate it..... and.... new gauges... aftermarket ones possibly from Koso or Acewell for example. Flush mount them into a low profile 1/4" thick low profile, arched, section of aluminum mated to the newly cast housing. Brainstorming here...I figured I would share my thoughts on getting this thing together. It is winter and I have a few months to experiment. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I re-read Kelvin entries and something sort of hit me. Keeping it within the design of the trike and not a collection of bolted on parts. I spent the last two days looking at American, British, Euro and Japanese gauge designs. I even checked out British sports cars like MG and Triumph along with Corvette and Audi. I came to the conclusion there is no wrong way to make a dash panel.... From the early 427 Cobras with reverse speedometer to the latest and greatest stuff there is. I decided to "simplify" the design. I will be Making a couple of sample designs then deciding which way I want to go after I give each a try. If this works then it would save a LOT of fabrication time trying to mate, match and modify OEM stuff to fit a custom trike. That's it for now.... Pictures in about a week.. maybe two. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Erik: What you hit on was 100% correct. I pointed out the old Rover as a classic car with a very plain dash panel. Function over form. I lived in the UK for 4 years and drove a Rover 2000. It was (at the time) one of the nicest cars I ever owned. I enjoyed the ease of maintenance, the interior was leather, and of course the instrument panel was a cluster of gauges placed inside a box and mounted on a shelf. Great function, not fancy but reliable. Rover set a good theme to follow. Just keep things simple. That's what I am doing with my dash. I am going to keep it simple and easy to build. As I said, give me some time to work out the details and design. I will be posting pictures after the holidays.. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 17, 2019 2:30:22 GMT -5
PAGE 25 Kelvin... Thank you for the post. I mentioned the Rover sedan because of its uncluttered functional design. The Morgan has a clean flat panel incorporating a decent layout for a revived modern antique vehicle. However, I believe the direction I am heading could be called efficient and minimalist. (And hopefully tasteful) The Eco-Exo is basically a 3 wheeled motorcycle (scooter if you will) and I will be pursuing a design that emulates what could possibly be found on the Ducati and Kawasaki Ninja motorcycles. With the bonnet cleaned up, hidden wiring and tasteful mounts for the windscreen and clocks, I think I could have a respectful looking product at the end of winter. Ideally, I would like to utilize the 2008 gauge cluster... (I have 2 of them???) the fault code reader and feedback systems to the ECU make troubleshooting easy. If I use an aftermarket Multifunction unit such as Vapor, or Acewell, I will still have all of the features of the original clocks with the exception of the dealer mode display for the fault codes. Trying to adapt the OEM gauge housing is probably not going lend itself to a clean design. There simply are way to many lines and odd angles that clutter the look... however, it can be made to fit. So, there is the challenge for the 2007 and newer Suzuki Burgman 400 donor. How to use the maximum amount of parts from the donor to reduce build costs and labor, and still have a completed project you can be proud of. I will be posting pictures when I have a finished design.... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I am not sure how the 07 up AN400's dash works, that's a question for the Burgman forums but I do know the 650 will not operate without a stock dash plugged in. The ECM gets feed-back from the dash unit. The speedo/odometer are not just digital display but the signal is also. The 07 400 up does not have a speedo cable like the 02-06 400. Of course, just go to 02-06 front wheels and cables to drive a speedo would work. I'd bet that Suzuki made it 1000 RPM @ 60 MPH like most mechanical speedos. Dave. The 2007 and newer Burgman 400 will work without the OEM dash. I had my Eco-Exo utilizing a 1998 British spec Suzuki Burgman speedometer. It will start, run and does not seem to miss a lick. FYI, all US spec Burgman 400 have electronic speedometers.. even the Old British spec I used was electronic. No mechanical cable to deal with. The 2003 to 2006 have the wheel sensor on the front wheel. The 2007 and newer have the sensor at the rear axle. Another FYI, the speedometers do feedback information to the ECU ON THE 400'S... Entering the dealer mode setting starts a dialog as one example. To what degree it communicates is not outlined in any manual I have referenced. All I know, is my speedometer is in my basement and I can start and ride my trike without it. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts The older spartan dash panel did not have a tach, but all you really need is a speedometer and the tell tail lights. I have been working on my OEM clock set. I wasn't exactly thrilled by my old install job. I have the rough layout finished, now to hack off the jagged edges and apply some smooth Sanding and slick filler. I use a combination of cabosil and/or West Fairing compound number 410. The mount is ready to finish as well as the sunshade. I just need to get to it. Well, that's it... Erik, its been a pleasure..... Have a Happy New Year celebration.... then let's see what 2015 has in store for us all. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Chances are Stue mounted the gauges under the front panel here and still have big leg clearance. If he'd weld tubing around it he'd protect himself from sharp edges and it would be legal I have seen chopper bike gauges which are all in one. If you placed one on the front panel you'd create a glove compartment on the dash area LOL!! What I meant is outside the box thinking will bring you good alternatives. If I were to design my own trike it could be pretty wild in simplicity. Happy New Year to you too.I guess mine will be street legal in 2015 No gauges, no harness in it as well, Still a nice concept IMO and a 2 seater: mevowners.proboards.com/thread/454/first-public-pictureremarkable this one has a brake pedal and twisted throttle. I'd expect this one to be hand operated only which would be great because the throttle and brakes on the An400 are designed for hand operation and that's always a better choics as converting to foot operation. Cheaper too... Oh, well... No gauges, no harness in it as well, Still a nice concept IMO and a 2 seater: mevowners.proboards.com/thread/454/first-public-pictureremarkable this one has a brake pedal and twisted throttle. I'd expect this one to be hand operated only which would be great because the throttle and brakes on the An400 are designed for hand operation and that's always a better choics as converting to foot operation. Cheaper too... Oh, well... Erik, that is the ECO-EXO, not the ECO-EXO-R. You can still order one. It uses the Burgman 400's long seat and "L" lever steering. That is the model I'd start with for my 650 build.
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Post by roger on Feb 17, 2019 2:34:59 GMT -5
Dave... why don't you jump in there and place your order. You can be Kelvins first buyer. You already have a lot of experience to draw from in your own life's skill, as well as those of us on the forum. As you said, you can weld and fabricate so this should be something well within the skill set you already possess. The real issue to building a trike with a 650 isn't the build. The 650 engine could be installed with very minor to moderate modifications. Mostly rear suspension and cooling system mods. The real problem would be how to keep it stuck to the road at the speeds you say you intend to drive it. It would be very interesting to watch your progress. Let us know when you make your order.. of course you know I am just calling your hand, but only in fun... seriously though, give it some thought. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Formerly Aberdeen Washington Erik.. I was looking at the stuff on the prototype build. It was/is a minimalists dream. Rear view mirrors that incorporate the front blinkers, down to no gauges. It is VERY CLEAN. A small speedo could be placed in the center of the handle bar yoke and the front and rear brakes could have been separated utilizing larger hand master cylinder controls. All and all, MEV and company gave this design some serious thought. PS: My gauge mountings and dash mods are shaping up.. Pictures in a couple of weeks. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Just putting the spot putty on the gauge housings to seal the pin holes and take care of imperfections. I bought a small spot sander and it gets into the tight corners and difficult to reach areas. Sanding is a breeze with it. The weekend will be slow. Everything will be closed down until Monday. I don't want to start something only to put it on hold until the marina opens. It is where I buy my epoxy and fiberglass supplies. Once I finish the gauge mounts, I will start on the plexi-glass windscreen mount. The jury is still out on that one. I ordered a pair of mirror mounts and cafe style mirrors. I was in my shop turning some aluminum stock down to size. I will make the adapters required to make the mirrors viable and usable. Lucky I do not have side bags, otherwise I might have to bolt a broom handle across my bonnet and reattach the new mirrors to that in order to clear my Line Of Sight behind me. Those are the updates. Not a lot to tell except it is coming along, ever how slowly. So... happy new year everybody, let's make 2015 a safe ride year. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 18, 2019 1:02:04 GMT -5
PAGE 26 I am still working on my gauge mounts. Epoxy really takes its time curing. I have the dash mounting assembly done and in primer ready for top coat. I also am finishing up the windshield mount/lower trim piece. I am fairing it in and it should be finished in a week. The entire bonnet and tank cover will be repainted matching yellow. The dash housing and acrylic windshield will be a charcoal or black... something to balance out all that yellow. I will have a pin striper paint a parting line between the black and yellow. I have a lot of projects going on at once and with the holidays behind me, I still find it difficult to dedicate time to really polish off this task. Slow and easy is how it is going. I woke up this morning with my home heating system leaking. Lucky I did this sort of thing before I retired. $40.00 for an expansion tank and air separator and problem fixed. My Eco-Exo will be on the road before the snow melts so, I have time to take my time getting things done, provided something else doesn't go wrong.... fingers crossed... I want to wait for it to be finished before I post pictures.... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I am posting this because it appears the is no activity about on the Eco-Exo forum. I am nearing completion of my gauge upgrades. The pieces are all finished and in primer. I delivered them to the paint shop Monday. As soon as they are finished and mounted and the trike is put back together I will take a few pictures and post them. I have come to the conclusion to make the kind of cosmetic changes I did, you must be flexible on the design direction as well as acceptable outcome. It isn't because the design path I took was a problem to do, it is the fact that every change you make, has the potential of affecting everything else. I did not take the path of least resistance, but worked out the design by means of acceptable appearance, function, and ease of use. I deleted the GPS and kept the iPod and bought a RIDERS CLAW mount for it. I also inserted an overlay piece of aluminum to cover the OEM arched 1" dash bar. This addition was not in the plans, but seemed like a nice touch so why not. Anyway, pictures will be posted in a week or so, you can see what I mean. Winter is here in New England and with a vengeance. Worcester Massachusetts is the official heavy snow fall leader Nationwide. We have more snow than most mountain resorts. I spent the day with a roof rake removing 4 and 5 foot drifts from my roof. Spring is a month away and hopefully the snow squalls and blizzards will go away before then. Warmer weather is an "event horizon". Roger Worcester, Massachusetts It does seem to have gone a bit quiet lately yes, though I expect the winter cold is denting quite a few people's enthusiasm to get out into the workshops/garages and working on their trikes. I've been busy taking the latest donor vehicle apart and re arranging the workshop yet again to accommodate another set of components plus contemplating if I need another trailer or if I should modify one of the two existing ones I have to take the Eco-Exo demonstrators to shows. I've built several machines over the years and I've come to the conclusion that particularly with kits things are always fluid to say the least. Looking round paddocks of any of the shows when kit cars get together reveals every time a variety of different ways of doing things. Very much looking forward to seeing more of what you and everyone else has been up to and for us here in the UK that just get a few inches of show once in a while I'm sure we'd all be interested in seeing what a few feet of snow looks like on the workshop. Kelvin Kelvin As I said in the post above, all my bits and pieces are being painted. Between snow removal and keeping things in order my free time has been a bit limited. I am in the process of making my switch block. It will contain 5 switches. 1. Emergency flashers, 2. Run/Stop switch, 3. Dealer override switch, 4. Power accessory switch and finally 5. Brake switch override. The switch block will be mounted at the bottom edge left side of my dash overlay which is a hunky 3/8" thick piece if aluminum flat stock. It is cut and shaped to match the arc of the dash bar and of the switch housing around the steering column. It is flat across the bottom running left and right. It makes a dandy place to mount accessories like my iPod and the switches. I will try to accommodate a GPS but I seriously doubt if I will use it. The painted bits should be back in a week or so, more pictures when they are finished. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts The newly redesigned bonnet and the modified windscreen: The instrument cluster in its new housing. If you look closely you can see the new dash panel that my iPod is mounted to, it extends across the full width the of drivers compartment. Quartering front side view showing the molding of the modified windscreen mating to the bonnet. I also installed new side mirrors and the OEM headlights. Clock lights illuminated I apologize for the poor quality of the pictures. It was -5 degrees F outside and a cozy 22 degrees F in the garage. Later, I will be Making a narrated video outlining the different modifications since becoming street legal here in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. Just to point out the changes.. I added the intake scoop and side cover. I shortened the rear fender and inset the taillight. After that, I added the new seat pad, the mirrors and headlights. I also redesigned the original bonnet to accept an integral windscreen and instrument mount to accommodate the 2007 and newer Burgman 400 clock-set. Finally, I fabricated a dashboard complete with power distribution switch panel and Ipod mount. This about sums up the changes. In all truth, none of the changes were actually "needed" but we're personal preferences. The extra work was worth it in end from an improved design in both function and form. All switches are in the same location, the iPod is in direct eyesight and can be adjusted as easily as a stock car radio. The smaller headlamps and mirrors clean up the front and of course the windscreen and instrument cluster lend themselves to a cleaner leaner appearance. The open top Sparco knockoff steering wheel allow me to see all the instruments at just a glance. (Probably the only real needed change) I have to thank Edward and Erik for providing a good deal of motivation. Erik for his minimal simplified design and Edward for his patience, know-how, and brutal perfectionist honesty. Both are great builders to have in your corner when you need technical guidance or a friend. Thanks guys... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 18, 2019 1:14:21 GMT -5
PAGE 27 Looking good Roger! It looks like you are all set for a great summer's worth of riding. I can always get a larger cattle prodder if you get bored Edward I have my trike officially under the blankets. It is finished for this season and ready for the summer rides. The redesigning was a bit of a chore, sort of like plunging into the unknown. The 3/8" aluminum dash panel was done out of total frustration on where and how to mount the switches and the Ipod. I may still make a mount for my GPS but as long as my cell phone works I will use that and just keep in in my pocket. There was a system of evolution on my project. I wanted to make it "my own" in design. I believe I did that but it was not an individual effort. If anyone is to be successful in anything, it always comes out better as a team effort. Everyone that I spoke to or corresponded with was more than glad to assist. Ultimately it was me following the suggestions of Scott, Edward, Erik and a few of the other guys that occasionally wrote on my forum page. I knew NOTHING about epoxies, fiberglass, suspensions, or design until these guys offered their assistance. My Eco-Exo-R is finished. It officially named Special Vehicle or (Spec-V) Motorcycle here in Massachusetts. It's name usually gets a "HUH?" from people that ask what it is. I have shortened the name for those that ask to "Exo 400", I have been getting the response of "OH!!" since doing that. Go figure. I have been flagged down by the police while out on a ride Just to look her over. There has never been a question of it being street legal by any of them. It is in fact street legal, DOT and Emissions compliant. It can be driven in all 50 states. Women mostly in parking lots have asked me to take their picture with it. I get thumbs up from guys mowing their lawns and while they drive past me. I even had a State Police officer do a video of me while he drove beside me. It tells me two things the trike is different and they like what they see and....... the bright Yellow paint catches their attention. Since my Eco-Exo-R is completed, my entries into my forum page will be more event oriented rather than doing a build. It will take some time to get decent weather to do a video but we shall see what turn Mother Nature takes in March. I will be more than happy to provide anyone with information on my trikes evolutionary process as well as "how I did it".... again... Thank you everyone. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I took my Eco-Exo-R out today and had the 2015-16 riding season inspection completed. Spring rolled around on the calender but winter is still hanging on a bit longer. It was nearly 50 degrees today so I put on nearly that many miles going the long way round. I needed to do a little shakedown ride from all the work I did over the winter to check things out before Taking it out on the open road. It did great, no problems were noted, so let's hope this sets a trend and that it continues. I was recently diagnosed with a hearing loss requiring hearing aids. For what it is worth, if you are also wearing a hearing device for the first time.... Remove them before wearing a helmet. You will get ghost noises and distorted feedback. If what happened to me is normal, then expect our hearing aids to react most unpleasantly to engine drone when ramping up and down the RPM scale. Even with the snow and the water on the roads the ride today was a promise of what is ahead for all of us this summer. Start those engines and smell the exhaust, wear out the tires and get them dirty, no garage queens this summer. Go for it!!!! Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Roger, It must be hard to live where the weather does not allow more that a few months of riding weather. Up here in the Northwest I have driven the car to work once this year, when the front wheelbearings locked up on my Burgman650. Coldest has been 19 degrees F, dry but very cold. While in the ARMY I fired 10,000's of rounds in many different weapons it is amazing that I do not have any hearing loss. The loss I do have is at 1000 Hz, caused by the test tone that we used in telephone circuits. Dave I will be riding out to Washington state again in June. Not on the Eco-Exo but my Victory CCT. I had it converted to a trike from Lehman. I bought the independent LLS system with reverse and the raked front end. It is now painted Black Cherry Pearl (ice). I may be in your neck of the woods around the 25th of June. I was just out there 2 weeks ago on family business. I got to meet a Washington State Trooper. Nice fella.. he didn't feel obliged to shoot me for speeding.. I sort of like that. (And no, I didn't get a ticket either) it was very nice weather. I took Route 12 thru Packwood, Mossy Rock and over White Pass into Yakima, then on to Dayton Waitsburg and Pomeroy and on into Clarkston. My hearing loss comes from working in and around and on Jets for 20 years while in the Air Force. I have wicked bad tint us and the hearing aids help with that. I just can't wear them under a helmet. They squeal and squeak and make a mild chirping sound. I will be doing a video later, but right now will wait for better weather. The snow is down to about the 2 foot mark in the front and almost gone in the back. It won't take long now. Eddie revved his up and tested his HiT clutch. He has that custom exhaust and a power commander too, so it has no problems getting down the road. Did you fix your 650 yet? Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 1:44:43 GMT -5
Roger, if you need a stop over with some tools let me know. I was around all sorts of machinery while in the Army too. I was one of the fools that did wear ear plugs. I have 2 Burgman 650's. My 08 is my daily commuter and my 03 is broken and has no tupperware. The 03 would be my donor bike if I do a 650 trike. I also have a 1980 GL1100i Interstate Goldwing that I could trike too. Dave: +I appreciate the offer of the stay over. As time gets closer, I will have a better idea of my route and plans. Right now I only have a general layout of my ride plans. I suspect it will be a long wait for the 650 platform to roll out of Kelvins garage. At that, it will most likely be the prototype. The sales and marketing of other kits here in the US is almost non existant, so if you are waiting for the Eco-Exo badge it looks as though it might be a bit of a wait. Kelvin is playing his cards close to his vest and understandably so. Still, the 400 Burgman is a good bit of fun and you could probably get a kit before summer if you decided to go that route. The GL1100 platform is a good idea. Literally thousands were built and parts are always available. I have seen plenty of home made conversions from stake side pick ups to jets. Yes really, one was made to look like an F-16 fighter. For what it's worth, my daily rider has been a snow blower, but it's beginning to look like I will be able to ride the Burgman 400 once I take it to get the inspection done. My other bike is the Victory CCT/Lehman trike Crossfire conversion. (Now that's a mouth full) It would be nice if more buyers of the Eco-Exo trike kits would post pictures of their finished projects. It would give everyone a chance to pick up new ideas and could lead to possible manufacturing refinements. I know there are at least 6 kits here in the states, but not sure how many went to the Continent (Europe) or Australia.... That's about it for now, got to get things going here. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I suspect it will be a long wait for the 650 platform to roll out of Kelvins garage. At that, it will most likely be the prototype. The sales and marketing of other kits here in the US is almost non existant, so if you are waiting for the Eco-Exo badge it looks as though it might be a bit of a wait. Kelvin is playing his cards close to his vest and understandably so. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Kelvin is right to do so. He needs tunnelvision to get things on a pace. Erik: No doubt, no outside distractions or influences would mean purity of design. In order for Kelvin to make this project his own, his design is what matters, otherwise it is "just traffic". I believe I am Para-quoting Kelvin a bit. I have seen the Scorpion trikes, those scream like they have no upper limit. The T-Rex, TR1ke, and a few more out there all have higher performance charts: speed, horsepower, torque, and "price$". The one thing I can say about what I have is, it is affordable, it is sporty, it is fast and fun to build and drive. Note to Kelvin: You asked me for some pictures. Let me know what areas you are Interested in, I will do my best to provide them for you. I am sorry I couldn't do it when you made the request. If you still need them, I will get to it. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 1:49:24 GMT -5
PAGE 28 Have you ever seen the Etrike? Stu offered light scooter donors as an alternative drive train way back but it's a mice budget project too. vids show cornerings are quite amazing. If this was kitted it could be a nice alternative as well but only drawings available which makes an entry level a bit steep for many starters I guess. Have a browse! I took out the Eco-Exo-R today. I did about 80 - 90 miles, stopped for coffee and enjoyed the sunshine. Temps were in the mid 80's (F) and just right for a cruise. Got lots of stares and people taking pics with cell phones. Ah yes, Tis the season to enjoy the sunshine. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I took out the Eco-Exo-R today. I did about 80 - 90 miles, stopped for coffee and enjoyed the sunshine. Temps were in the mid 80's (F) and just right for a cruise. Got lots of stares and people taking pics with cell phones. Ah yes, Tis the season to enjoy the sunshine. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Where's your photos then ..... Don't be shy, you've got the wrong vehicle to be shy with Today was just for me to enjoy and unwind. The Eco-Exo-R ran as "smooth as a cat over glass". It was a great ride and wonderful weather. Next ride will have pictures. I am about to embark on a 10,000 mile odyssey on my Victory XCT Crossfire Trike. It is a Lehman conversion. The weather looks quite promising on and after the 18th. . ? I will be going through states like South Dakota, Montana and Northern Idaho. All known for their mountains and/or wide open spaces, along with unpredictable weather. I am looking forward to seeing old friends, standing on the banks of a nice trout stream, with a few in my creel. It will be a time for celebrating life, old times and for what lies ahead. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts PS: Depending on how Fred does with his trike, we could have a newly registered Eco-Exo-R in Pennsylvania soon. He has been in contact with me on some of the detail work. Sounds like he has things well in hand. Have a great trip Roger sounds like you've got the perfect reasoning for it. Enjoy
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 1:57:02 GMT -5
I am having some pin striping done to my Victory Crossfire Trike. Tomorrow I am starting my long cross country ride. The trike will be double checked today and loaded. I depart at 5:00 AM in the morning and when the day is finished I will be somewhere around Toledo Ohio. Total distance for the day will be over 700 miles. I have not been neglecting the Eco-Exo-R. I had it out for a nice ride this week. Actually I went on a ride twice so far. Not as much as I would like, but I have been getting the kinks out of the Victory after its conversion to a trike. There were more than I thought, but at least they are addressed and corrected. The Eco-Exo-R got a wash and wax, it is now beneath a cover tucked away in the garage. Well for a neglected trike it's looking good Roger. I have to confess mine's been hauled up over the winter neglected in the barn too but I took it out for a spin down the country lanes yesterday and loved every moment of it in the sunshine. I'm hoping to drive over to Beaulie in it at the weekend but that's just 45 miles. Heavy rain today so I am hoping things wil have dried for Saturday or Sunday. Enjoy your trip Roger Now that's a picture. Beautiful Manor Home nicely set in the green English countryside. The trike looks great enjoy the ride. I made it to my first stop in Idaho. It was 2,8000 miles in 4-1/2 days. Tomorrow is trout fishing and a picnic with fried rainbow trout straight from the stream... with all the trimmings. Roger Scrambled eggs with fried Rainbow Trout and taters, breakfast for a KING. I just had a traditional fish and chips lunch from the local chippy. (You might need to look that lot up as it's a lot of English wording and tradition that doesn't usually translate to American, chips here are what you call French Fries only bigger) Doesn't quite match up with fresh Rainbow Trout picnic by a mountain stream that's for sure! Sounds like a great trip you're having there Roger all that's missing is the Eco Exo and I'd have asked/no demanded to see photos too. The photo of mine is just along the road where I park up some of the vehicles I don't have room for in the workshop which happens to be the barn belonging to the house in the pic. I should have got one of the Eco Exo in front of the hose at Beaulieu too really. Lots of old grand houses like that round here. not too many trout stream though I am back from my ride out west. It was 30 days and 9,000 miles long. For the most part the weather was very good. The first 3 days however, were either wet or cold. After that wonderful riding beneath blue skies. The fishing was great, the seafood on the West coast was delicious as was the prime rib in Montana. The Victory trike ran great. The only issue was the headlight was lighting up the trees instead of the highway. I made an adjustment and all was good. My longest ride day was 900 miles and my shortest was the 250 mile hops going to and from side attractions. While the 900 mile ride in a single day sounds like overdoing it, the location was Montana, Wyoming and South Dakota. All have 80 MPH speed limits, so "going the distance" was pretty easy. Once I get more time I will post a few pictures, but for now I have a long list of things that need attention. It was a great ride, and I got to enjoy visiting family as well as the good friends I grew up with. More Later Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:15:51 GMT -5
Would love to see some pics from that trip. I've done the Alps a couple of times to go hang gliding and did do a video of the trip down there and back in the car. Found this little stuffed kids dragon that I had clamped on the glider's uprights and on the car's windscreen wiper, which was a bit of fun. Did some editing of it when I got back and wound up recording over my flight round Mont Blanc. Not a happy bunny! Days of VHS eh Meet my little guardian angel. She is painted on the back of my trike and is in memory of a dear friend that passed away last month Just a couple of pictures of the fishing trip in Northern Idaho. The old guy with the beard is my best childhood friend Tom. His baby sister is my Guardian Angel that passed..... linkThe California Coast at Bodiga Bay near Santa Rosa Simply referred to as THE BIG TREE a giant Sequoia or Redwood measures over 300 feet tall and 21 feet diameter at the base. The Carson Mansion now owned by the Engomar Club located in Eureka California along the Redwood Highway.
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:25:57 GMT -5
PAGE 29 This is Wyoming scenery. It was like someone laid down a beautiful green carpet of grass. The Horses (and one mule) eventually came around to inspect me. Again, Wyoming where the Buffalo roam and the deer and antelope play....... and skies are not cloudy all day. I took a ride to the Berkshire a few days ago. I was on the Eco-Exo-R and stopped to take a few pictures in the small village of Rowe Massachusetts. Again, Rowe Massachusetts. This is a recreational pond spillway. It is typical of what a person will find when exploring on the Mohawk Trail. This is another spillway about 3 miles upstream from the spillway in the last picture. Only the very latest in mass transportation here in the back country. ? Eureka is where I first got to see the Pacific. Thought I recognised the tree. They are truly awesome you really need to be amongst them to appreciate them. Over 2000 years old and still alive! Did you say you had the Eco Exo with you on this trip? Kelvin: I did not have the Eco-Exo with me on the trip to California, I rode my 2012 Victory XCT trike. The last set of pictures I posted of the spillway were taken locally. I was driving the Eco-Exo then. I am currently trying to work something out with Ed so we can get our Eco-Exo trikes together for an extended ride This summer. Perhaps here in New England or possibly meeting at an alternate location. He has a fancy trailer that he uses to transport his trike for long distance rides. It is truly a "toy hauler". Sometimes using the Eco Exo isn't the best thing to ride especially when you are talking about a 1000 mile cross country just to get to the place you want to explore on the Eco-Exo. A trailer comes in handy. It would be great to get the other guys that own this trike here in the USA to send pictures of their builds. It would be nice to meet for a ride, compare notes and builds and in general have a good time. When Fred finishes his it is quite possible to get three of the six owners here in the USA all together. Jim in Texas has not posted anything in a long time. With the Polaris Slingshot having troubles getting approved in Texas, Jim may have issues along those same lines and may have given up on his build or sold it. The two owners of the kits sold in Colorado simply do not correspond at all. Since being back from my trip, I have done my best to wear the tires out on my little yellow trike. I want to have some pin striping done to it, but perhaps in the fall. I need a winter project. I am looking for something strange and weird (on 2 or 3 wheels) Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Kelvin: I did not have the Eco-Exo with me on the trip to California, I rode my 2012 Victory XCT trike. The last set of pictures I posted of the spillway were taken locally. I was driving the Eco-Exo then. Aha that's kinda what I guessed. Good to hear the Eco Exo got an outing too Yes one drawback with living in a country that's the size of a continent is that you guys are so spread out you rarely get to meet up! Fortunately here in Lil' ol' Britain we're a bit more compact and we have some events we can share and meet up at. Sadly these are getting fewer each year but I think we'll just have to start gatecrashing some others too which I've started doing already Regards contributions to the forum from owners, well we may not have masses of quantity but the quality is superb and you guys have done some fabulous things with your trikes. I'm really glad to be able to read about your exploits and adventures and love seeing them too! PS the new trike I'm doing might hit the right spot for you on the winter project front
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:35:24 GMT -5
The project of a newer trike sounds very interesting. As soon as you can release the details on it let (us all) in on what you're cooking up "in the secret laboratory garage". LOL.... I am looking for a way to transport my trike in the bed of my Honda Ridgeline. I am figuring on a frame to park the trike on, cinch down the chassis on it, then load it into the cargo bed of the Ridgeline. My brain is quit full of notions. Sometimes I feel as mad as a hatter...getting details sorted out. LOL. I need to get some sleep.... night all Roger Worcester, Massachusetts The secret area to the workshop is constantly needing a clean up as there's dust and debris flying frequently but it all adds to the mystery when I appear from the mist that wafts out of the doorway to deal with people dropping by the workshop. I'd love to let you guys see what I'm doing but I want to get it finished first. It's looking good though and I am well chuffed with it so far. There are one or two people who've also seen it and I love their reactions when they see it. First impressions have all been excellent. Re your Honda, I don't know if you have the crew cab or the two door but I'd measure up that cargo bed if I were you as the Eco-Exo is surprising in it's dimensions both width and length. It is handy that it's triangular in plan though as you can fit 2 in the space you'd normally consider for one. I've got to get a trailer specifically for the trike sorted myself too as my car trailer is not ideal for it. 3 wheels can be a pain to load up as you need a center ramp or some buddies to help lift. The bed of the Ridgeline is narrow and short. It will fit the trike in but only backward and the wheels would be hanging over the tailgate. What I wold like to do is make a powered loader that would lift the trike into the bed and without using my friends muscle to get it done. When You finish the design work and the prototype on your new trike... make sure You emerge from your garage (out of the mist and dust) with a few order forms.. Looking forward to seeing it. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I'd consider a winch and a set of ramps though they will need to be pretty long to reach up to the cargo bed. Bear in mind also the weight of the Eco Exo, 220kg I don't do lbs sorry. You don't want to wind up wrecking the tailgate. One of the few who has been allowed in to the back of the workshop to see the witchcraft is indeed in discussion with me at the moment about the new trike. Gotta get some steelwork ordered very shortly. In fact I should be doing it today but I've another job I need to be doing this afternoon instead. Kelvin At 485 pounds (220 kg) it would probably apply some stress to the tailgate, but the entire mass wouldn't be pressing down on it. I will probably load it backward, that way if I got lost at least the trike would know the way back home. Of course there is always building a custom trailer with an aerodynamic cowl to deflect stones, sand, and the odd cat. Eddie built a fantastic trailer, but he has a place to park it as well. If I did decide to make one, it would be not much more than a pair of wheels and a tongue. Just something to take it from point to point. When the premier of the newly designed trike arrives and manufacturing becomes a reality, will you still build and sell the Eco-Exo-R? Also, has Stewart Mills been in your workshop? Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I'm sure you can sort out a couple of load bay extensions to rest the front wheels on that will take the load away from the tailgate. I like your plan on the Smart Trike though teaching it to find it's way home. Pretty nifty idea Hope you file the patent on it so that Apple and Google don't steel it from you! Stuart's not ventured this far down South so he has not seen my workshop. Don't worry the Eco-Exo will continue to be made I'm just adding to the range Not much going on lately here. I have been out in/on the Eco-Exo quite a bit. It has been in the garage today though. It was very hot, hazy and humid, your skin simply wants to melt. I have been gathering bits and pieces for a 1986 Honda GL1200 Goldwing Interstate I recently bought as a basket case. I am almost done with the gathering process and during the winter months I will be getting it in shape. It will be a winter project, you know, to prevent insanity while being shut in due to the cold weather. I read Edward's thread on his newly styled gauge cluster. The white looks fantastic. Good job on that Eddie. Tomorrow is Monday and that means mow the lawn, trim the shrubberies and take out the rubbish. I feel so blessed to be born a male. Jeeze!!!! Well, with that being said, a need go to bed. Night all Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:43:09 GMT -5
PAGE 30 Thanks Roger! I took the trike and trailer to Door county where there are small one lane twisty and hilly roads along the lake to have fun with. The white dash looks and works great and am glad I disassembled the original instrument gauge cluster to be able to put the white overlay instead of the black overlay in it. Removing the gauge needles and replacing them with the ones from the white overlay and getting them adjusted just right took some time. I now still have the original instrument panel with the original LCD displays showing actual mileage on the odometer and got the clock to work properly. It was worth the effort and really like how it lights up at night. It is great in daytime also. I have over 2200 miles now and keeps getting better every day. I just love this thing and was the best investment to date. No problems encountered at this time but I will change the rear tire during Winter with a Metzler to match the fronts that I bought a few weeks ago. The front tires show very little wear so very happy about that. I also went to a few car shows and many people were very interested in it. Most asked what dealer sells them until I told the I built it. That kind of blew their minds and were very complementary about it. I can't wait to see what Kelvin has in store in the next few months we hope! Edward Well Edward, there's no doubting that you quite like the Eco Exo then The new trike is coming along nicely Edward, though this is where things are really slow getting things all symmetrical (lot of GRP bodywork on this, I must do an asymmetric vehicle sometime instead!) I see summertime has taken its toll on the forum participation. SLOW! I know I have been wearing out my trike one switch at a time. My Emergency kill switch broke off. Cheap Chinese junk. Somehow I suspected my switch selection would bite me in the "donkey". Well, it broke off in the run position, so will replace it at the end of the season, probably with another junk switch. I probably have less Eco-Exo time than Eddie this season, but still managed to do somewhere near 1,500 miles and I will continue to ride into or through November. Yesterday was a fun day. I got to take out a Polaris Slingshot. It is really a car, not a motorcycle. You cannot place your finger on any single item and say it is a motorcycle.... whereas the Eco-Exo has its share of motorcycle parts from the engine to the wheels and a lot in between. That being said, the Slingshot was fun to drive. The only thing is, if I had $26,000.00 to spend on a fun vehicle, it would say Mazda on the front and after I wore it out,or nearly so, I would tear it down make an Exocet out of the parts. Well, that's all folks. I just wanted to add my penny's worth of thoughts... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I am getting ready for a ride this Labor Day weekend. I depart September 3rd for the Blue Ridge Parkway and a motorcycles only camp ground. "Willville" motorcycle camp offers cabins, as well as tent sites. They will also provide breakfast if you choose. They are situated in "The Meadows of Dan" in southern Virginia just north of the North Carolina state line on the Jeb Stuart Highway. I have been there one other time and was impressed with the total experience. They don't have you sign a waiver, or give you a list of rules as long as your arm. It is sort of the honor system for behavior. A bikers nature dictates a little color or flamboyant behavior, but that's normal. I am also going to continue on down to Atlanta Georgia to see some friends. I would like to stop by Exomotive to see how Kevins operation is going. I will call to see if it is okay to do that. In all of this riding, it will be on my Victory trike. If I had a snazzy red (yellow) trailer I would tow the Eco-Exo-R down and ride it in the area while I was there. I am, however, going to take it for a two day outing before I leave for the Blue Ridge Parkway. In comparison, it is close by, but is a little over 100 miles up the road. I will install my tail trunk and stow my backpacking stuff inside and head up to Vermont. Well, that's about it. The summer days are dwindling down to fall and then winter. I have enjoyed my riding time and my time with friends and family. I hope everyone takes time to have fun. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I think we'd all like a smart trailer for our trikes. I've got a small frame for one I'll be modifying at some point shortly hanging up in the workshop that I need to get on and work on though sadly it's not going to be anything like as grand as Edward's. Good to see you guys getting some fun miles under your belts even without trailers and I have to agree they are fabulous machines to be cruising through the countryside with on a summer's day.
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:48:58 GMT -5
Roger ..if you get near me (Reading Pa area) feel free to stop by and checkout my progress and give me some tips etc. Fred B I am back from my ride down south. It has taken me a bit to get back into the swing of things. On the way back I decided to Iron Butt it home. I rode 1210 miles in 21 hours. It was from Perry Georgia to Worcester Massachusetts via Interstates I-75, I-81, I-84 and I-90. It was a bit grueling but not overwhelmingly so. I was tired but not dead tired. I did not stop at Exomotive this trip. My time was a bit more compressed than I would have liked so had to bypass that stop. The Motorcycle campground at the Meadows was great. The weather was wonderful with only one downpour. I was having lunch when it happened so had only to dry off the bike. The Blue Ridge Parkway is ideal for a sport bike and not so much for a touring model. My trike is great for going straight and fast but the twisty windy roads are difficult. It would have been a good stop at your place Fred, but as I said my time was a bit compressed. As it was, I made it back Monday at 2:00 AM and started catching up on overdue projects and work here at the house. Today will be spent riding my Eco-Exo and enjoin what's left of the summer weather. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Hey Fred, for some reason I thought you were over on the West coast side but it seems you are just up the road from my cousin in Exton. Hmmmm maybe if I do visit it gives another reason for having a trip state side. Might have a chat with her as her sons are pretty good on the mechanics side of things though usually it's trucks and cars they mod. I had (have) an unpleasant issue with my Victory Cross Country Tour trike. It seems with all the fanfare about the transmission being "bullet proof" mine took a hike. It is vibrating, surging, and has a very distinct oscillating thrashing or whirring sound coming from it. It only does it in gears 1 through 4. It is smooth in 5 & 6. It is most likely the counter shaft or gear cluster bearings or both. It goes in the shop today. Both sets of gears are reasonably priced if that is what is needed. The Victory dealer is 17 miles from me and they have a huge facility and naturally a Victory certified mechanic. Let's see if he knows his "stuff". It seems as though the only reliable transportation I have now is my Eco-Exo-R. I am just now finishing the final work on my Honda GL1200 external alternator conversion. While the conversion itself is finished, I am installing the electronics. Stereo, clock, intercom and CB radio. The antenna and mount are in the mail. I have to say, the alternator conversion was not all that difficult. The extra equipment fits quite close to the OEM fan, and crash bars, but it does fit and runs quite well. Until I receive the antenna and mount, I will,need to keep the seat and tank shelter removed. I went for a ride in the Eco-Exo-R the other day. A jacket feels nice. I might install an electric cable for my heated jacket. I like the idea of keeping warm with a light jacket rather than layering up. The Jacket is for Gerbings and it saved my bacon a few times this season. Rather than hunkering down to deal with the cold, I just turn up the controller a bit. It really does keep your body warm. I have been thinking about redesigning the bonnet on my Eco-Exo-R. It may happen this winter, but I have a lot of other projects scheduled, and must do some thinking on it before I proceed. I like what Edward did, but to preserve his unique design, I would not copy it. I also realize there is only so much a person can do to fit a nice design into the framework. Ed did a fantastic job with his custom modification, mine will probably resemble his efforts with noticeable changes, perhaps a wider fish mouth grill and lifting the slope of the bonnet toward the front. It is time I got a start on the day. If and when I get time, I will post any changes I make to my bonnet. Now get out there and ride..... or drive. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Sorry to hear your Victory is off on a hiking expedition of it's own Roger. Hopefully the dealer can get it to tow the line, but it's good to hear the Eco-Exo is proving reliable. I'm afraid to report the CVT on mine went for a hike a while back and I've been too busy to sort it out, had a look online and seen some Youtube videos on what's involved with maintaining them and it looks reasonably easy to do. I just need to get all these other things sorted and it's low on the priorities sadly. I do like the heated jacket idea, my initial thoughts where a bit passée but then I recalled driving my old Spartan with the roof down all year round and remember the chilled kidneys after long trips when it wasn't summer time and the heated jacket sounds like a brilliant solution! Keep an eye on the battery though you might want to get a bigger one. I think Ed's redesigned nose is superb too and I'd love to offer it to customers but I don't want to rip it off as it's Ed's handy work and think he should get all the credit for it. The new trike will have a different nose entirely and will be able to facilitate a front mounted radiator too, I'd love to show you guys but I really do need to keep it underwraps till it's all finished and besides which it evolves frequently. I'm happy to say that I'm pretty much done though on the overal design and will hopefully be putting together a 'mule' shortly to see how it is in real world day to day use. All in all it's on schedule and looking good
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Post by roger on Feb 20, 2019 2:56:12 GMT -5
Well thanks for all the compliments on my nose job It has worked extremely well and is a snap to take off and put back on. Kelvin, I cant wait to see what you came up with on your new design. Roger, Well at least it is at the end of the season than the beginning. I am sure you will have it shipshape by early Spring. Edward Kelvin, I cant wait to see what you came up with on your new design. Like I say I'd love to let you guys see but then it would spoil the great reveal and besides it's constantly evolving. I'm off to Castle Combe for some circuit fun tomorrow and I've been busy with another car but even so I keep tweaking the trike here and there and lo and behold I changed a few other bits and pieces making quite a difference to the way it all looks and how it will be used. If I had a penny for the number of times I've heard myself say "God I'm good!" I'd be a reasonably wealthy man, it happened again yesterday whilst I was supposed to be changing the battery on the track car and thought I ought to just top the charge up before I fitted it. Of course that gave me a few minutes to tinker Right I really must get this other car finished off and test driven........ Yep, Edward has the "Nose" for the job, He really "Nose" what he is doing in the design department. Now that Edward has retired he will probably do a tweak here and there on the trike (and everything else he owns that has more than one moving part). Retirement has a way of doing that to a person. I found a low miles Victory engine. Same year same bike 5K miles on it. It is in California and will be here the 1st of October. I will keep the other engine on the shelf for spares. I got the old 86 Goldwing basket case all put together. It runs great and has all the bells and whistles including a cassette deck in the Stereo. Wow, what will they think of next. The CB works and the intercom is loud and clear. I will go for a ride on my Eco-Exo-R tomorrow and just enjoy the day. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Funny you mentioned that Roger I decided to make a ramp in my back yard that is on a channel to Lake Winnebago. I lucked out and had some guys with a trencher stop by and dig out the bank and fill it with 1.5" crushed gravel at a nice slope. After vacation I will make the 2x8x20' frame and get it installed on the gravel bed. I will use my new zero turn mower to pull the trailer from the garage to the ramp. Just back it in, Slide the boat off and put it by the dock. Go sailing and do the opposite back in the garage stall. It is all carbon so I leave it in the garage for UV protection. It only weighs 160LBS so easy to handle. I can paddle it all day at 2.5 knots. Any little breeze and I can paddle sail at 5-6knots. Going to Charleston, SC in eight hours so getting some rest. I sure hope I don't think of something along the way as it is a long drive Edward IMG_0278 by evanbelkom, on Flickr image001 by evanbelkom, on Flickr We are all sitting here waiting for Kelvin to tilt his hand enough to show us all the design that will lead the Eco-Exo into the future. We all built trikes (or are in the process). The forum activity is rather slow, not a lot of news to broadcast about the Eco-Exo. Fred is pressing ahead, Eddie and I have ridden ours for two seasons and we are all looking to you Kelvin to pave the way to the new design... either that, or we all buy an Elio. If anybody has any questions about how safe, how strong, how reliable or how "anything" I would be more than happy to share my build experience... I can speak for Eddie as well we all will share..... Kelvin... LOL :-). I hope you realize you've been punked.... in good fun.... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 23, 2019 1:02:44 GMT -5
PAGE 31 roger, I have a good buddy in Albany who I plan to visit in the next few months , maybe sooner .. looks like you are a couple of hours away from him ... perhaps I will visit and see your eco-exo in action and take a close up look ... would you be up for that? We are all sitting here waiting for Kelvin to tilt his hand enough to show us all the design that will lead the Eco-Exo into the future. We all built trikes (or are in the process). The forum activity is rather slow, not a lot of news to broadcast about the Eco-Exo. Fred is pressing ahead, Eddie and I have ridden ours for two seasons and we are all looking to you Kelvin to pave the way to the new design... either that, or we all buy an Elio. If anybody has any questions about how safe, how strong, how reliable or how "anything" I would be more than happy to share my build experience... I can speak for Eddie as well we all will share..... Kelvin... LOL :-). I hope you realize you've been punked.... in good fun.... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Sorry guys, I've been busy with several shows and the likes going on over here in England along with several other things. Not entirely sure what 'Being punked' means exactly in "English" English but no worries. I did see that several of you had been chatting about the windscreen and shroud recently and was pondering about maybe making up a more substantial moulding as a simple add on with a housing for the instrumentation. The new trike is still firmly under wraps and personally I think it's much more stylish than the Elio so I'm not worried by that but then I guess I'm bound to say that aren't I? Kelvin... being "punked" is simply being kidded. I know you are not going to tip your hand on your design. I wanted you to know that I am still interested in your efforts. As far as the Elio, it will probably cost 3 to 4 times more than the projected $6500.00 advertised price... that is if it gets built at all. As far as the windshield bracket goes, it is a great idea. What about moulding fixtures for the 2003-2006 and 2007 to current speedo's. It would make the build seamless and would save a ton of engineering headaches.. Well for the owners. ? I can wait for the grand roll out and debut of the Eco-Exo. ? Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Aha I thought it meant something like that, I've heard it used several times and figured I knew roughly what it meant but you know what it's like with slang I'm sure, there gets a point where you need to check you've got the right interpretation of it. I'm up for any suggestions to help make the Eco-Exo easier to build and more versatile. I do however love how people put their own interpretations on their vehicles, it's one of the reasons I love Kit Cars so much. There's nothing more dull than a street full of BMWs. I'll be looking at the instrument binnacle shortly on the new trike, I've already roughed it out in 3D but will be refining it shortly. I was just looking around at the postings. The forum is quite inactive recently. There is no real news or changes happening here on my end, but thought I would at least see if anyone was around. I am just curious.... worldwide, how many Eco-Exo trikes have been sold? I thought from reading different postings here and there that the number was around 12 or 13. I count 6 here in the US, 4 in the UK and 3 on the Continent and one possibly in Australia. Of the six here in the US, one is in Texas, one in Wisconsin, one in Pennsylvania and 2 in Colorado and mine in Massachusetts. No on has heard from the buyers in Colorado and the Texas buyer, Jim Cox has dropped off the scope. It seem Fred, Ed, and me are the only ones that correspond with Erik and the builders in the UK. I find it a bit odd that people (builders) would invest their time, funds, and space to a project as interesting as this and neither offer nor accept technical guidance or seek camaraderie on the forum. We all have something to offer by sharing differing points of view. We all bought into a very unique kit vehicle. While participation on the forum isn't mandatory, it would be very interesting to see how others completed their projects. Last winter I completed part 1 of a 2 part facelift. Phase one was when I added the new instrument cluster, molded the cluster surround and incorporate my windscreen into the bonnet. I also inset my tail light into a shortened rear fender and added an actual dash plate on the curved bar just in front of the steering wheel. Part of the preliminary work was to add the new side cover and air scoop to aid in engine cooling. There will be a bit more information on phase 2 as I get further prepared to start the project. Until then, I will be making some templates and getting the necessary materials to make it happen. There will naturally be pictures, and accompanying information. I figure by the end of the month I will be started. Until then, keep in touch everyone. Roger Worcester Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 23, 2019 1:18:04 GMT -5
... I am just curious.... worldwide, how many Eco-Exo trikes have been sold?.... Interesting question and one that jointly Scott @sat351 & Kelvin @qdos are only really able to answer. If unsure of the total maybe just a figure of how many Kelvin @qdos has sold since taking over the project in December 2014? nigel I also would be interested what the total is now. Since retired I am always searching the latest in reverse trikes and there is very little new. It will be interesting to see what Kelvin has come up with in his new design. Edward I also would be interested what the total is now. Since retired I am always searching the latest in reverse trikes and there is very little new. It will be interesting to see what Kelvin has come up with in his new design. Edward Edward, I am waiting to see too. While there is nothing wrong with the current Eco-Exo, it is not RIGHT for me. I will hold off till I see. I am searching for another frame kit but $20,000 is not in my budget. So how is retirement going? I too gave up and retired Dec 1st, 2015 and DO NOT miss the 81 mile round trip commute !!! I have lots of time and could be sticking steel together but no good kits out there that I like. Dave Retirement is Great!!! It will be hard to find a kit at your price point that will work. If you do it yourself you have a 50/50 chance it will work properly. Or you could sell all you scooters and get a used Slingshot:) I talked to Stuart before redesigning the A-arms and really was biting the bullets hoping everything would turn out and the trike would be drivable when done. Without a good base that would not of happened. I think at the price point you are at realistically is going to very very hard to find something that will work well. Your hope would be to scourge the web and find a project you could complete. That is how I was able to build mine the way I wanted it to be. Being retired it would be hard to build what I have now. Roger did his best to save and I am sure he has about 9K or more invested in his now. Unless you have that kind of budget it will be extremely difficult to build something you can trust your life on driving at 55-65 MPH. If you do it in like a 2-3 year span it could be doable. But you need to find your match first. The funny thing is that both Roger and I have had fantastic reliability on ours to the point we never worry too much about breaking down when we go on a trip. See what some Morgan 3 owners have to say about that on the talkMorgan.com website. Edward I agree Ed. I am probably at the $9k price point right now. When I bought my kit, I had a bit of a nest egg built up to pay for my kit all at once, but Exomotive only wanted a partial down pament and the balance when it shipped. Truthfully It worked out better that way because it gave me a bit of money to pick up my donor scooter and allowed me time to add to my savings to pay the last payment. The kit and donor were just over $5k. I think my final figure was around $8k. There is a long list of parts, paint and Powder coating that took up the rest. If I built another one I could do it faster, but not for less money. It sounds like a lot of time, effort and money, and it is. There is a huge "HOWEVER" in there, and that is: it is just plain fun to drive, it returns more enjoyment per driving time than most people could imagine. Owning one of these gets immediate attention and a crowd around you at bike shows. They walk straight past all the $50k custom bike builds and look at what I brought. Even the police give you a thumbs up. When ever you buy and put together one of these, you become an instant celebrity of sorts. It's a feel good ride and people do notice. Dave, from all of your posts and conversations with other forum members, it is obvious you want "something" like a reverse trike or trike kit. The Eco-Exo-R is probably the lowest price and easiest to build. The next step up isn't going to be a little more, but a lot more.... probably twice the money. Get on the TR1KE forum and see what those puppies are going for as an example. If it were me, I would find a way to make it happen. Nothing is out of reach if you really want to put the effort into going out there and getting what you want. Price is always a consideration, not a roadblock. Good luck Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Kinda waiting for Kelvin to release the newest wiz-bang model. My luck I'd order a current model and the newest one will be what I really wanted. Dave. New is new but older is Tried and True. We are all hopeful of seeing what Kelvin has up his sleeve, or in the build barn as it were. Is it going to be whiz bang? I suppose it really depends on what your expectations are. To me a 2 seater would be great, but then the TR1KE could fill that biĺl, if that's all I was looking for, whiz bang to me is something innovative, different, stylish and in my garage. Hopefully the work has progressed on schedule and Kelvin is just knocking back a few waiting for the right time to unveil his new prototype Mk3 Eco-Exo..... Fingers crossed everyone Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Hi guys, Sorry I've not been around for various reasons partly as I've had some IT troubles over the holiday periods and not had time to sort them out (I need to buy some new portable IT as what I was using quite successfully sadly got mislaid and subsequently damaged rendering it unusable. Word of advice to anyone with multiple devices do write down your username ans passwords and keep them on good old fashioned paper as they can be a real pain in the ass to try and remember when your device you usually use is broken) Yes I've been busy and have rather a lot on my hands at the moment in workshop and barn as it happens, along with some great developments too but also a fair bit of delays from other things beyond anyone's control. Ironically I too was wondering exactly how many Eco-Exo trikes there are out there as there do seem to be more than I had thought all be it not vast numbers. So I don't honestly know what the figures are actually. May seem a bit crazy but this is a cottage industry in all honesty as is the case with the majority of the UK kit Car scene. I'm kind of between a rock and a hard place at the moment as I'm in that interim zone trying to get things set up for proper production of trikes, clearing out existing projects (from before the Eco-Exo) and developing the Eco-Exo with new models. Unfortunately there's been a couple of outside events that bring people to a halt which inevitably impact on plans but these are all really things that happen to everyone sooner or later no matter what walk of life you're in. I can promise you though that 2016 will see things that I hope and believe will excite existing owners/builders of the marque and I'm in no doubt will also excite people outside who have never even considered a trike before. Dave as to weather or not you'd prefer the up coming new Eco Exo variant or the one you all love right now I can't really answer that and you'll just have to make your own mind up. I'm aiming to have a launch in May though I think at the moment it's not likely to be a fully finished display model but I'll let you have an exclusive preview so you can decide should you chose to make an order. Inevitably along the way during the development there's lots of great ideas that also pop up and will eventually see their way into yet further models and each one will have it's own fans. I probably, really ought not be saying any of the above and should instead just keep my lips well and truly sealed until the great reveal of each development on the day it happens but I know you guys all have a passion for what you're building or indeed have built and I too share in that passion. So much so I bought the project and I'm burying more money into developing it further. Right I best be getting back to the grindstone and carry on with all these things in the workshop. Hope you all had a great Christmas and New Years Kelvin I have a lot on my hands as well. It seems it is the time of the year that old retired guys like me get the back burnered work started. I am in the design phase of work and will be at it for some time. It is odd, the designing part takes longer than the actual work. Go figure. I will be doing some routine maintenance to a Miata that I bought at the end of summer. I am replacing the timing belt and water pump. Not a difficult job, but with the cold weather it can be "tiring". My Victory trike has a new low miles (3,000 miles) engine intalled and has been completely serviced including a new drive belt. I replaced the blacked out exhaust heat shields with chrome. It looks very nice, and runs quite well. I temporarily donated the old engine to my local victory dealership for training. I will be getting it back this summer. They will use it to train their mechanics on complete engine overhaul including diagnosing a defective transmission on my donor engine. The engine part worked great, the transmission was in the beginning phase of failure. I already cleaned up my machine shop, got to paint the floors and touch up the cabinets yet, but for the most part it is done. After I picked up all my tools, I came to the conclusion that I cannot fix anything without using every single tool in my cabinet. I need to get ahold of how I work and clean up my shop more often. The Eco-Exo-R is in my garage beneath a cover. I placed furniture dollies under the tires to make it easier to move around. I will be replacing the tires as I said in an earlier post, so the dollies will come in handy when I do that. I also need to replace the broken engine kill switch. The tank is full and stabilizer installed. I pulled back the cover yesterday because I heard an odd sound coming from in front of the bonnet. As I pulled the cover back one headlight came on and I heard a soft snoring sound as the headlight dimmed and slowly went out. I covered her back up to allow her to sleep out the winter. If you read this Kelvin, do you have any complete Eco-Exo-R trike kits ready to ship? Before I start the riding season in April, I thought I would ask. I get a LOT of interest from guys (when I take my trike out for a ride) looking to buy "something". It would be good to know if there is an availability, or a wait. That's all for now... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Hold on to your snow shovels everyone. It looks like we are in for a huge Nor'Easter this coming weekend. I will bring out my snow blower tomorrow and crank it up. Lucky thing it has an electric starter. For those of you not familiar with what a Nor'Easter is. It is a s**t load of snow and a lot of wind and blizzard conditions. The storm usually isn't as bad as the snow removal. Kelvin, in your new design, incorporate a snow plow on the front and ship as many as you can make to Massachusetts... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 23, 2019 1:27:30 GMT -5
PAGE 32 A Nor'Easter will drop a lot of very wet snow and a lot of flat roofs will be at street level before its over. Take care. Bet we could cobble up a snow plow for the Victory. If you read this Kelvin, do you have any complete Eco-Exo-R trike kits ready to ship? Before I start the riding season in April, I thought I would ask. I get a LOT of interest from guys (when I take my trike out for a ride) looking to buy "something". It would be good to know if there is an availability, or a wait. That would be good but at the moment I've got to get some other vehicles out of my workshop and then Erik's is first for any attention but after that I'll be doing some prototype builds and tests so fabrication is being looked into at the moment whilst the workshop is like yours and too cold really for serious work at the moment. I'm waiting on temps to rise so that I can get some moulding work done. Kelvin Hi Kelvin I am in the same boat as Roger. Spring will be here soon and I have inquires on getting kits but using a 2007-2015 Burgman donor. The 2003-2006 are getting harder to find and not all the parts are available. Let us know if you will have kits available for 2016 and how many you plan to produce. Edward Hi Ed, Just a quick reply but Yes I'll produce a kit for any serious customer that wants to place an order for an Eco Exo. I'm also aware of the earlier Burgman being a bit hard to find suitable donors for so I'm interested in any preferences for specific donor bikes, as you know I have looked at the 650 also but that's a really big drive-train which isn't going to fit the Eco Exo as it stands. Kelvin I think the 2007-2015 Burgman 400 is the best choice for now and all future builds. I discussed this with Roger yesterday and to be able to use the wheels and brakes for the 2007-2015 Burgman will require to make the wheel hoops a little longer to fit the larger front wheels. Roger has it all figured out so just contact him for the details. Edward No pressure here huh?.. In reality my build is an Eco-Exo Hybrid. It has 2003 - 2006 front brakes, front wheels, upper and lower motor mount/linkage and radiator. The rest is 2008, including engine, wiring harness, gauges, fuel tank, muffler and parking brake. The radiator cooling fan is also a 2008. I used a modified 2008 windscreen and actually had to cut a notch out of the fuel tank so it would clear the throttlebody. I made an adapter to join the throttle cable outer tubes and used a tandem bicycle rear brake inner cable. Works great. The dominator headlights work well, the downsized rear view mirrors are bar end mirrors with a modified mounting adapter. The signal lights and rear tail/brake lights are all incandescent and from a Honda Rukus 2013. I used an XL Tillett CLONE seat with adjusters, Sparko CLONE open top wheel, and Bozo the CLONE yellow paint. Actually Hummer Yellow. I installed Bridgestone hoop tires and OEM brake pads, All Balls Bearings and cut down SOLID GL1100 Goldwing FRONT axles instead of the Burgman hollow ones. Now that I think of it, my trike is a bit of a mutt. None of the extras cost a lot of money individually, but everything adds up. The only (major???) modification to the frame was to cut the lower shock linkage mounts and move them left a bit. The 2007 and newer engine linkage attach points are not in the same position as the 2006 and older. No big deal. I also cut out the fuel tank mounts too and made my own. This has been a real deja voues moment and I don't really need to do a recap on stuff already on the forum... Hope this helps. By the way, the ideal spot to mount the mirrors is on the vertical support just in fwd of the X-O side frame gussets. Bar end mirrors are great. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I do not think Suzuki will change much in the future on the Burgman 400. All the changes will be cosmetic and you guys trash that anyway. Going from the smaller tire to the 2007 up larger ones will make pot holes and such a bit better. Put some Dr Pully 18 or 19 gram sliders and a Hit clutch and it will pull real nice. If you go over to the BURGMANUSA.COM web page you can read all about the 400.
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Post by roger on Feb 23, 2019 1:34:43 GMT -5
Hey Guys, I really do appreciate your enthusiasm and you're all correct. It's pretty darned good seeing you all independently coming up with similar ideas! I do wish there were more hours in the day along with all the resources of the mass production guys to do all this stuff but you can be sure that I am indeed aiming to do pretty much all of the above. Unfortunately though there are limitations on us all and no magic wands but I'm not at all bad at killing more than one bird with a stone so to speak. I know we would all love to see things move along at a rate of knots but it's generally best to get the foundations set right first and figure out a plan of action. Oddly enough, as I've just said you're pretty much all on the same hymn sheet. I really do wish I'd gone and moved over to the US some 15 years ago sometimes as you guys really do illustrate one of the best things I found over there amongst the people I met there along with friends and family I already have. That is your "Hell that sounds a good idea let's do it!" attitudes. I love American positivity, over here it's like banging your head on a dozen brick walls how negative so much of this little island I live on can be, but hey we don't do too badly and we do like to do things right. So once again thanks guys for your enthusiasm and dedication to these great little machines we all love. It's great having you all on-board and let's get along. Kelvin I had the privledge of living in England for about 4 years. I was in the USAF stationed at RAF Bentwiers/Woodbridge in Suffolk county. I was there around the time of the Rendlesham Forest Incident. Mid to late 70's. I flew in the Base Aero club and with the RAFGSA. Winch launch gliders made of Balsa, cloth dope and aluminum were what I flew, along with Cessna 150's and 172's. While stationed there, I found although we spoke the same language, it sounded a little more refined coming from the local folks. The cars absolutely amazed me. I loved the Mini's, Rover 3500, and my personal favorite was the Humber Scepter. Not the big "hotrods" like here, but small compact, packages of dynamite. All pre Common Market. One of the other great things about living there was the ability to make almost ANYTHING. There was a shop of sorts on every block. Small cottage industries that could make everything for anything. The only head banging I encountered at all was the very high standard the Ministry of Transportation placed on the vehicle inspection program... or MOT. I am not knocking head banging, it leads to some brilliant results once the pain goes away. Good ideas are easy, hammering out the details require a mandatory amount of frustration, trial and error and head banging.... Now to keep on forum topic... Kelvin, you are at the helm of the Eco-Exo project, do what you need to do (including the required amount of head banging) to affect an upgraded design. You really need to look at the 2007 and newer build platform and see if you can make it happen. Finding a crashed Burgman shouldn't be all that difficult. Changing motor mounts and making the front hoops a little taller are the two major changes. Easy Peazy. The idea of a Burgman 650 or silverwing 600 isn't necessarily a far fetched idea, but not for the Eco-Exo. The extra power could not be translated into a higher top end speed. The 400 already flirts with an 80 MPH top end anyway. A higher speed would require a much more sophiscated suspension and steering system. All that has a cost added. My thoughts are this. If you are indeed going to upgrade the platform, add all the tabs necessary for mounting the GRP stuff, modify the tank area so the OEM air box fits beneath the fuel tank, make the transition from older model donor to newer model, and perhaps look into engineering a reverse... whether electric, or otherwise. Also, make the transition from Gel coat color to an actual color pallet selection..?. Or offer white only or primer but leave the frame bare. The Fiat steering rack is okay but the steering column and rack could be swapped out for another more popular (international) model... small Nissan, Honda or Toyota. I agree with Ed, in order to move ahead and be successful, changes need to be made. Drop any 650 notions for now and once the newer 400 kits start selling, maybe a little R&D on more power might be okay. As we speak right here and right now, my trike is perfectly designed. Stuart Mills along with Scott Turner and co. Got it 100% right. I have not had any manufacturing or design problems arise. Massachusetts sets a higher safety requirement on vehicles than almost any other state. We are on an equal par with California. My build is not only DOT compliant, it is also FULLY emissions compliant as well. I have a Massachusetts license plate and inspection sticker on my rear fender, as well as a Massachusetts assigned Kit Manufactured VIN affixed to my chassis. Yes, they got it VERY RIGHT. My two bits worth.?. If you are in the UK, it's about 3 Schillings.? Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I have been checking the Eco-Exo forum, and there is no activity at all. It is difficult to stick to the true faith of the forum under these conditions. Since Kelvin has made a decision to sell his Manufacturing license, it looks pretty grim for future kits to be hitting the market unless a suitable buyer tosses his hat into the ring. Speaking of you Kelvin, I wish you all the best, you were a fantastic person to talk to, a great help on technical questions and I for one will miss your comments and entries on the forum. Good luck in all you do.. When it comes to the Eco-Exo-R I am very pleased with the design, the power options of 250cc to 400cc, and how it performs. I have fiercely and openly defended the power options offered for it. There are a few things that should be offered as factory (manufacturer) options or changes. With the older model donors getting more difficult to find, it would be a step in the right direction to make provisions for using a 2007 and newer donor. This would mean a change in engine mount location, utilizing the double rotor front rims, and changing the front brake caliper mounts. The fwd bottom of the fuel tank would need to be notched to make room for the throttle body, and the radiator needs different mounts. Other options that should included are: an aftermarket intake filter to include PCV mount and intake air sensor mount, an air scoop for the radiator, perhaps a matching side cover. The person that buys the license to manufacture hopefully will build kits for the donors that are available, and that will be available for a long time to come. Every kit builder is different. Each of us sees something different in essentially the same kit. There are very striking difference between Jimmy Cox's, Ed VanBelkom's Mine and Eriks final outcome. Even Freds build (in progress) in Pennsylvania is unique. Even after being completed we still refine and tweak and add our own personality to what is already a nice product. Items like custom lights, stereo systems, mirrors, seats, fenders and so on are all the little updates and enhancment's that makes the Eco-Exo truly belonging to their respective owner. So, who ever decides to step up and become a manufacturer of the Eco-Exo, it has so many possibilities they are nearly endless. All that is needed is to browse the forum and ask a few questions. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts There are a number of changes in the design worth reconsidering which would increase the over all quality. I believe Kelvin wanted to do it right in the first place but this takes time. I'd highly recommend not to make changes to the original design except a possible new donor engine similar to the original specs Stuart and Scott gave the Exo which is 120-400cc and make upgrades when production has settled. In this range I'd suggest a Honda PCX150 as a good alternative and I believe the airbox is facing rearwards on the CVT. I'd buy one brand new without tax fees, build it in the chassis and pay lower tax when it's road legal. This way it's a brand new drivetrain for decent money and marketing wise it'll last for a long time before an upgrade it needed.Unneeded parts can be sold easely because of the young shelf life and unused. Usually, a design lasts only 5 years which is the Achilles heel of kitcars in general having older donor engines... As an example, I believe a tR1ke with a low mileage 2002 R1 donor engine would be hard to source nowadays. The front fork construction could be addressed in a later stadium but it's highly recommended to change the layout and have the wheel axle and caliper flange aligned before it is delivered to the costumer. There are various options to do this and is done correctly current owners could upgrade their Exo if desired. There is lots of good ideas to be worth considering but the license owner just have to ask. I'm not presenting it on a silver plate. Personally, I'm very keen on the E-trike design as well which would be ideal for a fuel efficient(!!!) PCX150 engine and because we can buy the plans and make changes if desired it could be lots of fun to build as well. I agree with you Erik, there are a lot of options worth considering for the Eco-Exo chassis. The engine options have certainly been debated on the forum as a regular menu item. While a smaller newer engine could be used, it would largely depend on where you would like to drive. Driving the lowlands where you live, it is mostly flat and a smaller engine would be perfect. I live in the foothills of the Berkshires. It is quite the opposite, the 400 Burgman gets me around the mountains just fine. Anything smaller might not get the job done. While power options might change, a suitable donor like most MEV products, will more than likely be a used vehicle, such as the Miata for the Exocet, and other kit vehicles. Not to many folks would feel comfortable buying a new scooter or motorcycle for the sole purpose of making it a donor. There are other options open, like the merging Chinese manufacturing market. I believe Kymco, utilizes a Yamaha designed engine, and they have a wide assortment of models from 50 cc all the way to 500cc on their scooters, and they also have a few motorcycles out as well, but not sure if all, or just some, have the Yamaha based power train. I have been working on a few things on my Eco-Exo-R. Nothing very dramatic, just a small facelift. You know, like a nip and tuck here and there. I have gone past the design phase of it to getting the bits and pieces needed nearly finished. All that is needed now is a few common hardware items and a little color matched coating and I will be done. There is a thread entry where I outlined some changes I would like make. This falls in the middle somewhere, like a "phase 2" The newer instrument panel, dashboard with switches and shortened rear fender were last years mods, or "phase 1" I wasn't sure if this mod would be possible, but it looks good so far. I will post pictures when it is done. I have not seen Kelvin on the forum since he announced he would not associate himself with anything MEV. I know you delivered your Eco-Exo-R to him to do the MVSA inspection. He actually mentioned getting your trike through that process as a priority. I hope this sudden change of direction for him doesn't alter that priority. I need to get busy. It is about 7:30 AM and I am in need of coffee and a couple of eggs. When you get your trike through MVSA make sure you post it on the forum. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 0:36:56 GMT -5
PAGE 33 Erik, I hope you get your Eco Exo R sorted out and inspected very soon. I kind of know what Roger is up to and I think it will turn out super!!! After driving my Eco Exo R over 3000 miles I feel it is the perfect size engine for the trike.Roger is correct on what terrain you use it for. I have hills I climb here and it just powers up those without slowing down. It really depends on how heavy the total machine with driver is. Mine is 749 Lbs including the driver so the 30.5 HP of the 2005 Burgman 400 is just about perfect for me. Edward Hopefully, there will be a future for the Eco-Exo. I think Scott Turner and company did a great job for the image and marketing of it. An ideal candidate would be Kevin Patrick at Exomotive to manufacture for the US market. At present, any future discussion about what should or shouldn't be put in a new trike is sort of a mute point until production restarts. As for the rest of us, that already own an Eco-Exo, I agree the 400cc Burgman is the best choice.... not unless you are talking about 150 MPH trike, that can hill climb, tread water and fly through the air.... of course it would need something a bit more sophisticated.... perhaps, wings, pontoons and a propeller to start... LOL Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Hi Roger, Do check the price of the Honda Pcx150. It should be about 2900USD including taxes converted from Euro currency. If you buy an unregistered one, brand new, it may cost about 2k ? Sell the parts not needed, add the costs of the kit and convince yourself if that's a good deal. a very recent 2nd hand donor might not be cheaper versus a brand new donor like this.It is not ony the engine you need but all hardware connected to it as well! An400 are not sold over here thus are unobtainable (my donor comes from Spain originally) which cancels out your preference for me as well if I have to build an other one no matter how our country roads are. It's just no use hammering on this engine because there is no market for such a kit. Don't think if an engine is not suitable for you it is not worth using.After all, It's a super smooth high efficiency running Honda and many may like this point of view. They chop new Hayabusa bikes for dirt buggys ya know. It's not rocket science and done before and it extends the lifespan of the design quite a bit. You have to stay away from tunnel vision it's not getting one anywhere. Please do realize current owners of this kit have absolutely no control on this product. Only Future costumers do. We only bought a kit from former manufacturers which does not connect us to the future owner of the license except for the need to replace damaged parts. Edward is right, If the weight/power ratio is acceptable a lighter engine is worth living. I wouldn't mind if top speed is 65-70mph. I feel this is perfect for the Exo. I did check the price of the PCX 150. It is between $2,900.00 and $3,500.00. That is the pretax price. In Massachusetts the tax rate is 6.25%, so add $180.00 to $220.00 plus documentation fees.... all mandatory whether you register it or not. A used Burgman here is cheaper, or about the same depending on the year mileage and so on. I was not aware the Burgman wasn't sold in your country. I did read where you found your donor in Spain. I can understand why you would like the PCX 150 from Honda as the donor. The terrain, roads, speed limits and availability of donors make it perfect for where you live. I have looked for the specs on the PCX150 but cannot locate any immediate data on the engine, Horsepower and/or torque or any CVT info. For me to make a blind judgement for US applications without knowing the specifications would not be something I would do. I don't believe it is a matter of being tunnel visioned, or close minded. I believe the Burgman donor scooters are very appropriate and have sufficient power to propel the ECO-EXO over most roads here in the US, whether those are flat and straight or in a mountainous area like me. The CVT on the Burgman is also very durable and holds up well to all demands placed on it.....so far. We all have our ideas on what is best, but what we really mean is what is best for each of us. It is obviously a different situation for you. If Burgman scooters were dropping out of the trees in The Netherlands, we wouldn't have this conversation. Yes, I see what others may do to very nice high performance machines, right down to tearing up a very nice Miata to build an Exocet or similar vehicle, to installing Hayabusa engines in Dune Buggies and Smart cars. My trike kit was around $5000.00, the donor with 5,000 miles was $650.00. Yes, there were other expenses as you might well know. If my donor were in the price range of the Honda PCX150, then my trike would belong to someone else and I would own a Polaris Slingshot. All of this is purely academic.... we have exactly what we have and that isn't going to change. Any future development of the Eco-Exo is suspended until a suitable manufacturer can be found. You are correct, we are owners of a vehicle from a previous manufacturer..... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Erik Here in the states it is pretty easy to get a 07 or above Burgman 400 and is one of the most reliable scooter out there. So for the states that would be the choice. Where you live any scooter that is close to physical size and mounting probably would work. Every country is different but the chassis was designed specifically for the Burgman 250/400 so that is the preference. Sure you could adapt almost anything and make it work but in most places in the world that have Burgman dealer it is the best choice. I know you went the minimalist way but that is not for the majority of owners. As time goes by most of us gain weight and add more accessories and pretty soon the weight is up there and the smaller engine is struggling to maintain speed on a incline. The Honda Pcx150 has a gross weight of 397 LBS verses 860 LBS for the Burgman 400. My Eco Exo R weighs 749 LBS with me in it! Even with the lighter motor the trike would have to weight 220 LBS or less with full fuel! 220 LBS + 177 LBS and you would be at the gross limit of 397 LBS for the trike. I do not think you could build the trike that light. There are many more factors than just picking a different scooter to use as a donor I normally cruise at 55-65 MPH and I surely would not want any smaller engine especially going into a headwind. For me my Eco Exo R is not a commuter vehicle to get around town with. I use it for extended trips around Wisconsin. That is why I added the side hard cases, GPS and Stereo. While you may be correct for use as a commuter it sure would not work for how I use mine. I think Roger is correct in looking at the scooters from China or Taiwan that use the Yamaha motor. You can find those in most places in the world. Universally that would be the way to go to meet production for a global trike. For me I am super happy I have a Burgman 400 in mine and if it ever needs to be replaced I will just get a 07 and up Burgman 400 and make the changes needed to fit that year motor. Edward As I mentioned in an earlier post, I am working on a couple of modifications to my Eco-Exo-R. The progress has long since passed the design stage, whipped past the material purchase, and left the actual "making" the parts in the dust. I have successfully test fitted all 4 pieces. They have all been cut, trimmed, and modified. Each one was hand fitted (several times) until I got the desired outcome. Currently I am doing the fine Sanding and finish work before taking the pieces to be coated. This project was to include one more little change, but I am having difficulty sourcing the correct pieces. Not much I can say until I get them, except I will be posting several pictures when the current phase of my modification is completed. Right now the trike is being cleaned and polished and I am Taking care of some phase 1 preventive maintenance. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 0:41:57 GMT -5
We are expecting some overnight cold weather with -10° F (-23°C) with a -35°F (-37°C) wind chill factor. Anything I needed to do outside or in the garage has been put on hold. I did complete my sanding, etching, priming and prep on the 4 pieces that need to be coated. I will deliver them to the paint shop Monday morning. Not sure how long they will be in there. It is a small project so will be done in between jobs most likely. I will be removing the accelerator pedal and brake pedal to apply more grease, also looking at the linkage on the motor mounts as well. I did find a little wire chaffing beneath the bonnet and have already corrected that. I need to tie up a wire or two and my PM will be done. On a side note. I've been preheating the basement of my home as not to freeze pipes. All heat zones are set to operate and no energy conservation measures are taken tonight. It is the type of cold that freeze the trees and branches fall and go through your roof, or smash your car. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I actually got a bit of progress on my Eco-Exo-R. I took the 4 pieces to the paint shop last Monday and still waiting to get them back. I replenished the fluid in my brake reservoir and will purge the entire system later this spring. I took this time to make another accelerator pedal. I moved the location of the foot piece 2.5 inches forward and about 1.5 inches to the right. It is now lower than the brake pedal and far enough away from it that I do not accidentally press the wrong one when I need to stop. It still pivots from the same mount though. Today I was cleaning and polishing the frame when my polishing cloth snagged one of those high quality Chinese toggle switches and snapped it in half. That is two of the 4 in my switch bank that broke, so.... I bought a replacement plus a spare. I did manage to polish most of the chassis and GRP pieces before the cold came back. It was 55°F today. I also applied some conditioner to my vinyl upholstery to clean and keep it soft. All things considered, I got a lot done today. My trike is in the garage beneath it's cover doing quite well. Again... I will be posting some pictures once everything is complete. I figure by now everyone knows what my trike looks like and it will be a little different when I finish my updates. Cheers everyone Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I'm looking forward seeing the grp parts in orange good progress! Erik My GRP pieces will remain yellow. I really like the high viability yellow provides and it suits the Eco-Exo-R quite well. I hope to finish everything by the end of this week, but it depends on the priority the painter puts on the paint job. Once I get the pieces back, it will only take a couple of hours to install my pieces. A few screws and they are installed. Oh, forgot to mention, I also repainted my dash plate. It got a little scuffed. I took it down to bare metal, etched, primed and painted black with 2 coats of clear. Very glossy. I will be adding a universal cell phone/GPS mount and removing the Ipod mount. The noise level from the wind and engine make it nearly impossible to listen to music so I removed my amp and speakers along with the ipod. After all of this, new tires are next. Getting ready to ride this summer... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 0:47:15 GMT -5
Ok here is the modification. This really isn't anything new. Scott applied some carbon fiber panels to the demonstrator a couple of years ago. I like the color matched Hummer yellow since carbon fiber is sort of out of my budget. Beautiful job Roger. Now you have weather protection for those cold days. She looks really sleek now. Well done! Edward The aluminum is 5052 grade, .067" thick. It is very corrosion resistant and is used for aluminum boats and exterior applications. This interior is black with the yellow vinyl piping on the edges. You may have to look twice, but I relocated the accelerator pedal to the right and forward. Now I can extend my leg a bit more.
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 0:53:04 GMT -5
PAGE 34 Note my furniture dollies. They make maneuvering the trike a breeze while in the garage.. Ya can't deny, there is a lot of yellow there... It looks like a bumblebee ready to pounce. VIDEO WALK AROUND That is all that I completed. The accelerator pedal works quite well and is a lot more comfortable to operate especially on longer outings. The paint shop did a very nice job with the panels. They are attached with 8-32 stainless steel screws. I also applied a thin strip of clear silicone adhesive along the contact line of the frame as a sound suppressor. I do not get a drum affect. The panels are an idea I blatantly stole from Scott Turner and company. The entire job was about $220.00 USD. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:00:19 GMT -5
it's Looking slick Roger! Any reason for not entirely closing the sides? I didn't close the entire area because it wouldn't be possible without reworking my seat mounts and relocating the seat belt inertia reel. I used some coroplast (plastic cardboard) as a template to see how difficult it would be. I couldn't even get the coroplast cut around all the obstacles to begin to get it to fit. Then there was the issue of the seat hardware being entirely blocked off. The design I came up with was a very nice compromise to that. I sent Edward a few pictures of what was possible, he gave some very good recommendations, we kicked it around for a few days and this was the result. The side profile with the panels installed resembles the vane of an arrow or dart. All things considered, it was a tight fit installing the front pieces. The rear, simply dropped right in. I have full access to the seat hardware and seat belt mechanics. Thanks for the compliment. For a bit, I didn't think I was going to make it happen. :-) Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Roger it looks great. How do you get the thing onto the dollies ?? OK ...lift the front but the rear ..isn't that pretty heavy? Fred The front is pretty easy to lift onto the dollies but the rear is difficult without help. My son helps me with that sort of thing. They are the smaller ones from Harbor Freight. It makes moving it around in the garage great. Roger I went out for a pizza today. The place I like is 35 miles away. Guess what I drove there?
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:05:10 GMT -5
It really looks sharp Roger. How was your ride and how much more protection do you feel with the side panels? You could have had the pizza delivered! Keeps the milage low on the speedometer Now you wished you bought a donut LOL!! Hey Roger, Since when are you a moderator? I tell ya, the side panels make a difference in ride quality. The "feeling" of the added security may only be psychological but on a cold day, with a light jacket, it keeps you warm. There is no drumming effect, no echoing of road noise or feeling like you have just squeezed into a tin box. I can comfortably rest my knees against the side panels and be in comfort. There is now a MORE NATURAL spacing between the brake and accelerator pedal. I highly recommend moving the gas pedal to all Eco-Exo-R owners. It makes a huge difference. I am 6'-0" and have long legs, so for me this was a great mod. Speaking of Mods, Erik, I was asked if I would like to become a moderator a few weeks ago. I thought about it for a few days and I accepted. If there is anything within that scope that I might be able to assist you in, let me know. I am not sure how many moderators are on the forum that live in the USA, but there is at least one now... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts It is not really a difficult choice to make. The little yellow Eco-Exo-R is the winner. It is true, good things do come in small packages!!!!
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:12:50 GMT -5
PAGE 35 A short video comparing the Eco-Exo-R to the Polaris Sling Shot... Here is a short video of my ride today. Enjoyed the vid. If you were seen doing that in the UK the sky would fall upon you and if the powers that be could identify you from the vid, you'd be in court! What an anarchist!! That's the great thing about pseudo-anonymity, I could actually be anywhere, shooting that video, in the altogether, singing to the top of my lungs while in an alcohol induced stupor and not be hauled into her majesty's court here in the US. Of course anything could happen. LOL I do know the UK has some very strict laws and for good reason. I lived in Ipswich and Woodbridge (Suffolk) for about 4 years. The MOT's were not easy inspections to pass, and heaven help you of you were asked for the paperwork and not have it, or not have the tax sticker affixed. I will say this, it was my good fortune not to know anyone from law enforcement looking out the driver side window of my Austin 1100. Glad you like the video.. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Austin 1100! BUE 608B - my 2nd legal car, about '71- "hydrolastic suspension" - hit a deep pot-hole and the car disappeared in a green cloud of atomised fluid! I beieve mine was a 1968... white, red leather interior and nice maple dashboard. What it lacked in power it made up for in the ample spares available in the breakers lot. I also had the1964 MG version, front subframe rotted at the attach points and the poor thing was hanging it's head shame as the nose hit the pavement. Ah, the good old days....oddly enough, I really enjoyed both of them. They were worn out when I bought them, but they kept going in spite of it. No complaints here.... Roger Mine was boring beige (tawdry taupe in the US), sub-frames replaced once after the green mist incident. One time we had 9 in going to see the Jack Bruce band in Leeds - the 2 smallest in the boot, 3 in the front, 4 in the back. It was also used in the family business delivering frozen food; well worth the £75 paid.
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:23:03 GMT -5
I got 6 in a Mini once, we ran over a piece of chewing gum and couldn't get going again. :-) And now for something different. I believe Monte Python coined that... I took the Eco-Exo out for a ride this afternoon. I did about 60 miles through the (now barren) countryside. I wanted to see how the new Bridgestone Hoop tires performed, as well as make a few adjustments or tweaks on my new windshield air diverter. All went well, I stopped briefly for coffee then pressed on and made a full afternoon of it. It was sunny, warmish at 56F deg, (13+C deg) and blue skies. For the 1st part oF March, it was fantastic. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I decided I needed a better mount for my "Twisted Throttle" tail trunk. While the trunk is very well made, the provided mounting platform left much to be desired, so I decided to make something better. The 1/4" pieces of 6061 aluminum worked for mount. The trunk fits tight and comes off with a push of a button. The trunk will be a permanent addition and will come off on a case by case situation. The cleat at the trailing end is for latching the trunk, and the bar across the forward edge is for the trunk mount tabs. The powder coated aluminum has a much better appearance than the original mount. Mine is smaller, but has a better cargo capacity. :-) For the price of one of those Polaris trikes, I could buy a nicely equipped Factory Five or Exocet, or TR1ke. Not to mention a new Miata with all the trim. I did a test drive last year. It drove like a car, handled like a car, looked like a car that Elio should have marketed and had no heater, no defroster, no luxuries of any sort, including No storage space for going cross country, no optional convertible top. Here is what surprises me, nothing on the Slingshot was ever used to make a motorcycle operate, yet, It is classified as a motorcycle. Just sayin... Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I hadn't noticed the name of those giants! Perhaps a better phrase might be 'Jason and the Juggernauts' I am in agreement with that selection. Tomorrow will be a good day to "juggar my Naught" down the road a few miles in the Jasonmobile. I need a day to recoup from spring yard work. It is a huge pain in the *** but you can't say *** on the forum, or even print the word *** on here either. So, will plant the back of my pants to the seat of my Eco-Exo, rev up the engine, pop the clutch... "sort of" and go look at what the spring weather has done to the New England forests. I need a fun day out Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:32:31 GMT -5
PAGE 36 The ride today is on track. I am not sure exactly where I will go. I guess I will find out once I get there. It will be a surprise. There is supposed to be a very nice pub located around Jacksonville Vermont. It might do to pencil in a stop there. The weather is supposed to be good all day with temps around 70 F (21 C) so it is a perfect ride day. I will need to apply a little detailing spray to the Eco-Exo before I head out. For what it is worth, there are dozens of products that claim they are "the best". I use Honda Spray Cleaner. It cleans well and puts a respectable shine on the paint. If there is anything better, I'm up for suggestions. There are a lot of regional products, and some nearly impossible to find, all of those withstanding, if there is a nationally recognized spray cleaner, it might be something worth looking in to. Well, the day is just started, the sun is just coming up and I am still on my 1st cup of coffee. No rush today, I will not move from my chair until I have finished at least 2 cups. The Misses is getting ready for work. Sometimes I feel guilty watching my wife go off in the mornings, but I quickly come to my senses as a trace of a smile sneaks across my face..... "retirement" is not a bad word...(otherwise I couldn't spell it on the forum) Cheers everyone... Do what you enjoy, and vise versa. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Roger , today , thursday 4/21 .. nice day and I also took a spin ... I am still not ready to go tooooo far ..maybe 10 miles from my home base ..so again today , 30 mile round trip including some higher speed runs ..I did manage to shoot some video that might work ...I'll get it posted soon. By the way ..what is recommended procedure / products to clean splattered bugs from plex windshield?? I'm gonna have to do that very soon .. FB Fred, I just checked out your video and posted on your page. It looks like you had your trike wound up tight. I managed a ride yesterday but took out my Victory XCT trike. I needed to get more miles on it since the new engine installation. The scenery is still a bit winter-ish looking. Bare trees, and nothing green on the bushes. It surprised me how much junk people hide behind their homes and or barns. Foliage must hide a multitude of trash. I tell you, the thing I do to clean bugs off is hot soapy water and a soft sponge/soft cloth. I follow up with a spritz or two of Honda Spray Cleaner. The hot water softens up the nastiest allowing the cloth or sponge to clean it off. The Honda spray puts a little barrier between the bugs and the plexi...for next time. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Roger The rear trunk mount looks fantastic! It must be a great feeling to have that done and to be able to show people how easy the trunk is to remove or install. Been pretty busy with spring cleanup but the tasks are starting to dwindle down. Edward The trunk mount is a lot like your saddlebag mounts. It is designed to keep the trunk as a permanent fixture, but if I do remove it, then the remaining rack looks better than the original plastic piece provided by Coocase Inc. I also know all about the outside "GARDEN" work. It has been dominating my time this past week. Its just about finished and I promised myself a ride today. I noticed my rear tire is getting a little bit scalloped. It isn't howling yet and there is a lot of tread, so no real need to rush out and buy a new one just yet. I might want to see about a car tire for the rear when that happens. Dave may have hit on something. If a taller tire is possible to fit on the rear, then it may compensate for the difference in actual MPH and what is indicated on the speedometer. Remember, my speedometer sensor is driven by the rear tire. It is something to consider. Roger The trunk mount is a lot like your saddlebag mounts. It is designed to keep the trunk as a permanent fixture, but if I do remove it, then the remaining rack looks better than the original plastic piece provided by Coocase Inc. I also know all about the outside "GARDEN" work. It has been dominating my time this past week. Its just about finished and I promised myself a ride today. I noticed my rear tire is getting a little bit scalloped. It isn't howling yet and there is a lot of tread, so no real need to rush out and buy a new one just yet. I might want to see about a car tire for the rear when that happens. Dave may have hit on something. If a taller tire is possible to fit on the rear, then it may compensate for the difference in actual MPH and what is indicated on the speedometer. Remember, my speedometer sensor is driven by the rear tire. It is something to consider. Roger Roger, I moved this thread off of Freds build as it only relates to your build, so far. There are 1000's of negative posts on Darksiding and 1000's of positive ones too. Just saying, there are many 10,000 of motorcycle 2 wheelers that have logged 100,000's of miles on car tires on the BACK of their bikes. That said, for the 2008 and up remove the 150/70 13 Hoop and put a 155/70 13 in its place and it works well for two wheels so even better on three. I will not get in to a Car tire fight on this forum. Just read the facts from other forums, ether yes or no. It works for some, others think we are stupid. I do NOT do it just because it is cheaper, I KNOW I get 2-3 times the GRIP wet and dry and it will not slide out or roll on the sidewalls. So read this thread and many others on DARKSIDING a Burgman 400: burgmanusa.com/forums/52-burgman-400-2007-model/72242-car-tire-400-achilles-installed-checked-15-mile-test-ride.html Roger has lived up here in the Pacific NorthWet and knows it RAINS. Wet traction is a must when I was commuting 82 miles round trip in a torrential down pour. I was sliding my Bridgestone motorcycle tires out even when they were NEW due to over 1 inch of standing water. Went to a car tire and no more sliding unless I tried to. I have logged over 100,000 miles on a car tire with NO ill effects. Much better tire life. Better gas mileage, Better traction. MUCH better ride at 70 MPH. About 1/3 the cost of a motorcycle tire. Pain in the A$$ to mount is all.
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:38:11 GMT -5
According to FedEx I will receive my Darkside tire today. Depending on the delivery time I will start the change out today, otherwise it will be tomorrow. Pictures of the change out process, fitment and clearances will be posted. Stay tuned for further announcements. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Okay... here is the promised further announcement: KA-BOOM!!!!!! NO WAIT!!!! That doesn't quite do it. Lets put some protection round the tire first. Oh yes, I have a couple of old dog mattresses. One on the bottom, one on the top, then KA-BOOM!!!! NO WAIT (again) Lets check the bead to see if the tire has popped onto the rim from the first 3 attempts... Nope!!! So, lets increase the inflation pressure from 60 to 80 psi... still not popping on. Lets pound the snot out of the tire on the area giving me the problem... still not popping onto the rim, so, more lubricant, and more attempts, by pounding the tire with a heavy duty rubber mallet... or as I say a "BFRM". Still, nothing.... this brings back memories of my first attempt at getting to second base with my girlfriend in Junior High School.... at least, my attempts then met with some success even if I did get shut down for the homerun attempt...... okay, back to the KA-BOOM and the tire. As the inflation pressure passed 82 psi, the sidewall seperated from the steel bead and the tire exploded. The dog bed was torn to shreds, the air chuck was torn from the hose and the tire jumped about 5 feet in the air. I had a 25 foot hose at full length away from me at the compressor controls. No one got hurt, nothing outside of the tire and the sacrificial dog bed was damaged. My wife came running downstairs, my dog in close follow. He saw his dog bed, and was obviously upset to the point he lost control of himself. Still not sure if it was the explosion, or seeing the stuffing from his dog bed all over my basement workshop. So, what am I to assume from this exercise in Darksiding. For me, it is my first, last and only attempt at it. I installed the old tire, rebalanced it, lubed the splines and tightened the hardware. The cost of the Darkside tire was a very cheap price in learning a lesson the hard way. Darkside or not to darkside. The option is a personal choice, for me, it wasn't a choice it was a lesson. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Sorry to hear that it went badly. But of the few failures there are 100's of ones that went hard but came out OK. Yours is about the second one I remember hearing about. I am on my 5th car tire and all have been hard to get the bead to pop in place but they do. A friend that has a 2009 Burgman 400 has put his Car tire in a large warming oven and brought it up to about 125 degrees F and they go on smooth, he said. He also is on his 5th or 6th car tire and over 120,000 miles. And yes a tire run hard is hot enough that you can fry an egg on it so 125 degrees is not too much. It just makes the cold rubber more pliable. But we now can say that no Eco-Exo has a Car tire on it. Well, all things considered, the trike is not hurting for a tire, the rim didn't get damaged, and the old tire will last the entire summer season. As I mentioned above: This will be my first and last attempt at darksiding. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Well Roger I am glad you did not get hurt trying to install that tire. I always look at the big picture and ease of maintenance when building my trike. If I get a flat on a trip it will be easy to get another tire installed at any motorcycle shop if needed. I plan on following Roger's method and getting a cheap tire changer to change my own tires. That will keep the costs down so the difference in price will be a no issue for me:) Edward
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:45:37 GMT -5
PAGE 37 Now then, what is to be taken from these two pictures. For one, when the "Darksiders" say the tire goes on hard, they are not lying. When they say blow outs during mounting rarely happen.... be skeptical. The force of the air totally devastated the dogs bed. It lifted the tire 5 feet in the air and blew out a patch 5 inches long. It tore the tire compound from the wire windings that reinforce the rim seat. I was 25 feet away and I felt the concussion of the rapid loss of air. Would I Darkside, no not again. If someone provided a mounted tire on the proper wheel, then I might consider it, but will not buy another tire and attempt the same scenario. Here is where this lesson was handed out and here is where I say, I learned something. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts I just returned from my vacation out west. Naturally it is raining once I return. It is just as well, I need to relax and rest up a bit before I start my riding. I believe Monday is supposed to be dry and sunny. I want to do a little clean up on my Eco-Exo. It has been kept inside and beneath a dust cover, but it could use a good once over inspection and check critical bolts and fasteners for security. I know there hasn't been much activity on the forum. The Eco-Exo group is a small elite gathering of guys and after all, it is vacation time. I will be taking mine out tomorrow weather permitting. Yesterday I went to my local Victory/Polaris dealer and looked at and drove the Polaris Slingshot. The entry level model is about $22,000. The SL is ka-chinging in at close to $26,000, which includes a windshield, stereo, backup camera and 20" wheels and tires. I drove the SL. Plenty of power, handling was "good" comfort was "just ok". I sat down with the dealer and asked what sort of deal he could make. Basically, the price is chizeled in stone, they did not negotiate at all. The offer for my bike was low and the model they were offering was the entry level unit. Don't ya just hate it when you are looking at a very expensive "toy" that you would potentially purchase with a price tag that could gag a porn star, and the dealer is negotiating in pennies and refers to your next major purchase as a "UNIT". I personally have a difficult time justifying buying a "Unit" in the multi thousand dollar range. By the way, my Exo-Exo would not be traded in. I have a Victory Trike that was being offered up. Well, I am back. I need more coffee before I start my day. Ride safe. Roger It was a bright and sunny day, all was right with the world. It was just me, my trike and the open road in front of me. Suddenly I realized my day was about to take a change, but.... not necessarily for the worst. In my haste to get on the open road I was neglectful in one small but necessary component. GAS...FUEL... PETROL... MOTION LOTION...what ever you call it. As the engine staggered and eventually quit, the clutch auto released and I coasted to the edge of the highway. I got out, thoroughly disgusted at my stupidity. If I could kick myself in the backside I would. I turned the key on and watched my fuel gauge cycle and reset just above the red line reserve mark. I gave the gauge cluster firm tap along side the housing to see if the reading was correct. (As this would magically fix my situation) I removed the fuel cap and shook the trike....yep bone dry. As I was about to call a friend for assistance, a Massachusetts State Police cruiser rolled up behind me. He made several calls for me. I belong to AAA (American Automobile Association) but they refused to come out saying they were to busy. It is the only time I have asked for roadside assistance and it was denied. We will let our membership lapse and enroll in a different roadside service association. Long story short, the Trooper called another service and they were there in 15 minutes. He stayed until I was safely back on the road. This is typical of the sort of assistance the dedicated men and women in the Massachusetts State Police provide. He was very professional, extremely helpful and curious about my trike. He took a picture or two and asked if I bought it or built it. The end result was, it was a very pleasant encounter with the officer, he got me the fuel I neglected to get, stayed to ensure my safety and made sure I got back on the road. The day was saved and I rode the remainder of it thanks to a Massachusetts State Trooper helping me. Yay!!! Roger Worcester, Massachusetts Hi, pictures say a thousand words. Firstly, I wasn't aware that 'darkside' is actually a very well recognized and discussed topic on motorcycle forums. Whilst cleaning trike, I saw some black rubber marks on the inner front rims and got bit concerned. Took a torch to look up close, for sure the rim and car tyre combo is not working. This is madness and ignorance can kill. I am going back to motorcycle tyres - 140 fronts and 150 rear. Read some more on internet, and most tyre/traffic safety agencies have strongly advised against using car tyre on motorcycle rim. It could have been disaster for me. I feel morally responsible to share with my fellow members here. Rear tyre is fine, i think it is to do with the outer bead of tyre and how it fits the rim. As rear has lower profile, and less lateral movement compared to fronts running 80 profile. I am going for bike tyres: Front 140/70/13 (easily available), Rear 150/60/13 (hard to find) other option 150/70/13. That Ooze is most likly the lube you used to seat the bead. Darksiding will not cause the rubber to melt and ooze all over. A motorcycle 13 inch tire is really larger inside than a 13 inch car tire (Tyre). This is why a Car tire fits VERY tight on a Motorcycle rim. There are 1000's of people that say Never ever put a Car tire on a Motorcycle rim. But 10,000's of motorcyclist have been doing it for decades. I am one that has and will continue to do so. Back in the 70's (1970) we ran Bias Ply (Cross Ply) TRUCK 15 inch tires on Harleys. My uncle had a customizing Harley Chopper shop and I would set on the bike and rev the engine to about 3500 in 3rd gear while he pulled a curved "SHOE" up on the tire that would burn off the edges to round up the truck tire. Lots of smoke.
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Post by roger on Feb 28, 2019 1:52:00 GMT -5
Great thanks for the input, I was actually dreading even driving as thought that the front would burst. Will take to Tyre shop just to make sure that the tyre is not shredding as it seems. I didn't see how the tyre was mounted as the fabrication shop got it done. Many thanks for the reply as I was about to order a set today. Cheers As the inflation pressure passed 82 psi, the sidewall seperated from the steel bead and the tire exploded. Apparently car tyres should never be inflated above 40psi due to stresses imparted above this, appently the side can seperate! I got that fact from a deep analysis of the cons of darksiding, something I had never heard of before you mentioned the term. However I learnt something even more interesting from the same forum - darksiders and non-darksiders don't see eye to eye on the subject That is an understatement to say the least, the best bit was the debunking of long standing proven scientific friction theory by personal opinion! Here is how I look at this. If you feel you need/should do anything to your trike for your safety and/or piece of mind, then by all means do it. I agree with what Dave said about running darkside tires. Literately thousands of riders have car tires on their trikes and motorcycles, most without incident. If the ooz that is seaping from your bead seam is really excess sealant or some sort of lubricant, then you probably should have it checked. If there is ANY doubt in your mind about your personal safety or the safe operation of your trike then it would be wise to install motorcycle tires on your motorcycle rims. It is easy for us in our easy chairs to toss out all sorts of advice or speculate on a problem. All that, will do you absolutely no good when your tire blows or becomes separated from the rim at 60 MPH. It is "YOU" in the drivers seat and the people and property you might injure or damage will become your responsibility. And all you will have is "someone on a forum said it was okay". Don't take a chance with your safety or the safety of others. Get the tires the checked and if defective get them replaced. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts. There were several very nice riding days this week. I thoroughly took advantage of them. Yesterday was a 125 short hop and before that it was a lunch ride to "The Shady Glen" diner in Turners Falls Massachusetts. It was a great lunch, and the best raspberry cream pie "evah"!! It was rated by chef and food critic Anthony Bourdain a few years ago. We both recommend the pie..... :-) Massachusetts is cris crossed by thousands of rural back roads and byways that lead to small out of the way villages and scenic views. It is a perfect place to ride. The trees form a canopy over the highways and its like riding beneath natures umbrella. I do not think I will be riding coast to coast again and I have taken my Victory trike to a friend that is a dealer, and he is in the process of negotiating a sale. If it goes through, I means my trike will be gone as early as Tuesday. There is an older GL1500, that is being offered in partial payment. The GL is also a trike, Low miles for a Goldwing... 60K...and it is the SE model. It will replace the Victory temporarily, and is suitable for camping trips and freeway cruising. The Eco-Exo will be kept and ridden as always. I really enjoyed building the Eco-Exo. I met a lot of very helpful guys and made a few friends. However, it is obvious to me the Eco-Exo is not ever going to be produced. It is a shame, it is great fun to drive and not to challenging to build. I would build another one if the circumstances were different. I checked into tooling up to build a chassis. A professional manual ratchet type tubing bender with a single 120° 2" die was less than I thought, about $750.00. The pipe roller was quite cheap as well. These two items along with a MIG welder are all the expensive tools needed. Of course a good cut off saw would come in handy. So, for around $1500.00 you could be in business...... at least to fab up a chassis. Am I headed in that direction?? I think not, but would enjoy building another kit trike though. Well, its time to get going. Today is Sunday and we are going to the "farmers market" in Hardwick and possibly to a flea market at Reaetta. Now get out there and ride. Roger Worcester, Massachusetts
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